Re: hakka: Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: [Fwd: Re: hakka origin.]]]

[Chanh Lu <chanh@nms.fnc.fujitsu.com>]

I'm not a linguist but just a person who is interested in linguistics,
especially Chinese dialects( or languages depending on how you look at
it.)   From all the books I read, it seems to me that:

- Mandarin is a direct decendent of the language spoken in the
Zhong-Yuan area for centuries
- It's unlikely that it originated from Manchuria which was the origin
of the Manchus who spoke a non-Han language.  Han people were not
officially allowed to migrate to Manchuria until later in the Qing
(Ching) dynasty.
- Since all languages evolve through time, it's almost impossible to
pinpoint the birthplace of a language down to the size of a city such as
Kaifeng.
- From linguistics point of view, we can hardly call any particular form
of Mandarin "pure".  "Standard" is different.  It can be officially
chosen.  We all know that Pu-tong-hua (or Guo-Yu) is based on the
Beijing form of Mandarin.

Just my two-cents worth,
Chanh Lu

>
>
> I also believe Mandarin is originated from Manchuria. I am not sure
> about
> KaiFeng. I need to do more research on Mandarin.  I need to reiterate,
>
> there is absolutely no intention here to discriminate Manchurians (my
> wife
> is 1/4 Manchurian). The purpose of the site and the study is to make
> sure
> we appreciate the original "Han" culture and be able to appreciate it.
>
> Some day, this may be important. Just like the hierlograph of Egypt.
>
> SL Lee
> ******
> ***********************************************************************
>
> On Wed, 4 Feb 1998, Lee Meow Lock wrote:
>
> > Sorry if there is duplication in my sending as I have made a mess in
>
> > trying to reach you. I really hope this time it will get on to you
> as I
> > want you to reply to my last reflections on Sunday. I have by now
> > downloaded many of your essays on Hakka origin, culture etc, and I
> must
> > congratulate you for your excellent work. One of the things that has
>
> > puzzled me a lot is the evolution of today's mandarin. Specifically,
> I
> > have wondered whether there was a birthplace of native speakers of
> this
> > language, where such people are located and for how long has such
> > language been adopted as the official language of China. I am going
> to
> > read your article in detail to find out whether the answer is given
> or
> > implied. But I want to share with you now some clue I received from
> > people I spoke to: That the birthplace of today's mandarin is
> Kaifeng
> > and that the most standard or pure form of mandarin today is spoken
> in
> > Tungpei, north east China or Manchuria. If this is true, can you
> tell me
> > why? Thanks!
> >
>