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 Catch up with old friends
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-16-07 09:29

Coyo, Plat, Suen, Paul, SL Lee:

Haven't had a chat with my friends for a long time. Was caught up with work issues. Seriously though, I do have many fond memories here.

As you guys must have anticipated... still rather slow on the love life bit. Though a bit spoilt for choice. I seem to be rejecting even the pretty girls, no idea why. Perhaps not ready for a steady relationship yet. The girls in the office know I am shy.

Not that they weren't pretty. All my buddies thought they were hot. I just got tired of them real fast... in like less than a few months. They weren't intellectual enough, or started getting on my nerves with their inane remarks and clinginess.

My parents are getting worried now. :o)

In any case, my family's real slow in these things. Most of my cousins got married after 30 anyway. Earliest got hitched at 27. Half of those over 30 are not married. So I'm going to take my time. Safety in numbers.

Was working as a Risk Analyst for a while, now I have offers to go into either investment banking at a top foreign bank, or do another Masters degree. Sort of in a happy dilemma. Choices are painful, but in this case, its good to have so many options.

Got to decide whether I want the intellectual life, or career fulfilment. Still can't decide at this point. I prefer the stability of a scholarly life. My parents want to see their only son do well financially. They think I've done well enough academically and should switch gears. Still, I'm attached to the idea of solitude and study.

Still consulting my parents on these matters.

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 perhaps
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-16-07 09:38

Perhaps disclosed a little too much. Am regretting it a little now. I do get impulsive at times. Found out that intellectual compatibility is important to me, more so than the physical aspect in a woman. Good looks is still important, but nowhere near as important as it was for me in the past. A lot of the women whom I fell for during my school days would truly repulse me now.

Career wise, a bit confused - torn between a stable life of scholarship, or a dynamic one in investment banking. At 25, can't afford to make mistakes like I used to. Awoke to the realisation I have to make swift, rapid movements if I am to succeed. And once a choice is made, no turning back. Not young anymore.

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   07-16-07 16:16

Dear Liao,

Of course you will never mention me as your reference because I'm "only" a white person. Nevertheless I wish you all the best. I continue to study Chinese philosophies and know that I will never achieve what Chinese scholars established and still I continue to educate myself. With the help of S.L Lee and Yoon Ngan I improved my knowledge but I realize that i'm still a student. In practical life I had help from many Chinese friends. In the past you insulted me several times without any reason, at least not understood by me. Anyhow I have no hard feelings and think that your young age contributes to your negativism. I will not mention all the people who contributed positively but they know who I mean.

Kind Regards,
Andries

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Jane 
Date:   07-16-07 23:08

Dear Andries,

Good to hear from you and know that you are well!

Jane

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: SL Lee 
Date:   07-16-07 23:47

Andries,

Welcome back. We missed your participation. Please do drop in and make yourself at home.
--------------

SL Lee

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: platypus 
Date:   07-17-07 05:37

Liao:

I don't know if you've seen my message to you in the World Forum asking for your e-mail address. You put up a wonderful post where you provided an excellent retort to some forumites' arrogance, but unfortunately it got deleted because it was in an overflowing thread. Fortunately I saved a copy and was wondering if you still want it, in which case I could e-mail it to you.

Anyway, that stuff is a couple of days old already, so if you don't want to bother it's fine.......

Thanks for leaving a note hear for all the friends and fans. Yes you have some tough choices to make, but as you recognized those are happy dilemmas. I am normally extremely cautious in volunteering advice to young people, and that includes my teenage kids, because I realize how annoying unsolicited advice or comments can be, especially to young people.

Having said that, since you talked about some choices you're facing, perhaps a response on my part is not out of order. Investment banking or academia? Both are wonderful. So rather than choosing one, why not both? You could do investment banking for 5 years, and still academia could remain an option afterwards, may be not so much in econ or math, but certainly in B-school. I myself have always found the most interesting academics (at least in the social sciences) to be those with plenty of real life experience. Investment banking is such an all-encompassing field that it make for a great learning experience, except that you could be paid an obscene sum even while you're learning. Besides, investment banking is something that's best done when you're young, because one of the job requirements is that even after taking a 14-hour flight and smelling like jet fuel, without a moment's rest you're expected to get down to business and chew some guy's arse for lunch. :-) Believe me that's not something you want to do or continue doing after 40.......

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Jane 
Date:   07-17-07 07:57

Liao,

You left me out. :) Imagine you are in your 30s and still thinking positively of things. :)

just thinking there is nothing to lose at your age...

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   07-17-07 14:19

{...not even interested in pretty girls!..}
I've never experienced that.....Liao! What can I say other than to suggest you go and seek medical/shrink attention!! LOL.
Boy.....why get so serious at your age...La!

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   07-17-07 14:26

.."will not mention all the people who contributed positively but they know who I mean."

Is there a scintilla of hope that you could have possibly included me with that little list of yours??
Man....I sure hope young Liao will not get old as serious as you!.....sort of lack of the muscle to put on a laughing face or even to smile....not even occasionally! :-(

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-19-07 11:32

Plat you said to Liao, "You put up a wonderful post where you provided an excellent retort to some forumites' arrogance"

Now, that ain't about me, is it? Do share, Plat and Liao, I am quite curious. :o)

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 Music
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-19-07 11:39

Sensitivity and deep feelings are rare gifts. To have gathered upon oneself one or two of these good things, one should be satisfied. But the flip side is one gives up too much of one's personal power in the shuffle. Where one is sensitive, one is often held hostage by the crude. I am speaking my mind here, friend to friend, and you will of course forgive me if I have overstepped any bounds of friendship.

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 Treacherous passes
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-19-07 11:48

Always pleasant, sometimes exciting, to hear from you, young man. A nice post here to gather friends around :o) It is of course highly difficult to try to manage the critical points in one's life as you have intimated. I was fortunate in that life's circumstances narrowed the field for me when I was about your age. Having to choose can be a source of angst. Whatever choices you made, there would be alternatives that you had given up on. It is therefore important to regret not. A small dose of warring spirit shall serve, no matter the times or circumstances. My sincere best wishes.

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   07-19-07 15:22

Dear Jane,

Our friendship will never be at stake. I will continue to try to get in touch with you.

Love,
Andries

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   07-19-07 15:25

Dear SL Lee,

I had a lot of professional obligations but will contribute or at least try to. Thank you very much for your always encouraging words.

Kind regards,
Andries

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   07-19-07 15:44

Dear Suen,

Of course you are part of my friends. I learned a lot from you. You are completely besides of the reality. I have a sense of humor that is maybe not understood by you but omni present. When I communicate here I try to be neutral although I think that people who know me better will differentiate between information and jokes. I smile and even laugh easily that you could witness when we meet in person. I'm not the abstant professor that you take me for. On the contrary the people I know take me as a person and often even don't know my profession. In China I got privilages based on my friendship and not on my position. Of course financially the status played a role but nobody around me acted based on this. Do you really think that Jane, when we visited her, thought of me as anybody other than Andries the Forumite?

Regards,
Andries

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 Re: Music
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   07-19-07 15:53

Dear Coyote,

You never overstep any bound. Friends are there to confirm friendship or to remind conventions. We always had and will have nice conversations. My situation is a bit delicate. I retired 2.5 years ago but was asked to work full time only 1 month later. Since then I work as a consultant and lead engineer for several projects. Sometimes I feel tired and think that the society is in a desequilibrium that young people are unemployed and old people like me are needed. On the other hand I feel happy to still contribute scientifically to the development of technologies.

Regards,
Andries

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-19-07 21:24

Platypus,

Thanks for the great piece of advice. I probably missed out on that post. My e-mail address is indeed defunct, and I've just reset it. You can probably send me that mail now, if you still have it.

Suen,

Aiyah, I didn't say I wasn't interested in pretty girls, I said so far I haven't taken them out on a longer term basis, and I wanted to avoid developing a relationship with anyone in the office. I was embarassed twice already from similar incidents. But that might change soon, now that I've more time on my hands. You're right though. I find that the corporate world, there are definitely far more pretty girls than in school, and many are single. These women also tend to prefer intellectual men from good family backgrounds, not the ruffians on bikes (school girl preference) You suddenly have a whole lot more options. Its staggering.

Coyo,

Thanks for highlighting the existential uncertainty. Ever one for painting the most happy of situations - having choices, so bleakly. :o) I appreciate your metaphysical perspective, though.

Jane,

You are my friend, of course Jane.

Andries,

You are my friend. I've repeatedly reminded you of this fact from time to time. Why all the self-doubt?

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-19-07 21:43

Jane,

I disagree there is nothing to lose. In any case, as a Chinese you should know age 20-25 are the most important years for a Chinese person, as they determine the rest of his future.

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: platypus 
Date:   07-20-07 09:41

Of course Liao's retort was not directed against you. If it were I wouldn't have brought it up. :-)

Liao was right that you came up with a metaphysical perspective to the choice that he's facing. Believe me I rather envy your ability to do that--not only do you see past the trees for the forest, but you see acres of forests on all five continents. :-) In contrast I could never seem to come up with anything other than the practical and the mundane. It makes me wonder how I became such a bore over time.....or may be I've always been a bore but only noticed it myself more recently. :-)

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-20-07 14:25

Plat, you're not boring! Always found your comments interesting and appreciated your advice for its overall soundness.

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 Family systems
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-28-07 15:09



Marriage is a merger of family systems, not just two individuals. I often think a young man dating a young lady should really 'date' her parents, grandparents and so on... 'date' is not the right word, but used tongue in cheek.

Getting to know the family beyond the superficial niceties is a good weathervane to the personality of the intended spouse.

How to do this is difficult for it would actually take many interactions and many years to understand the family culture...who feels how in relation to money, power, love...who wields the decisions in such matters...and to what extent unfinished business of deceased parents/relatives influence the present.

The power of unresolved childhood emotions can motivate a 90 yr old person. Unresolved emotions can be the generating force for several generations, unbenownst to the younger generation who know not what force is driving the family system or what force is driving them personally.

Economic independence of a young couple would help to protect them from dysfunctional family systems.

A wise man said, 'Marry a girl you can talk to every day for the rest of your life."

I know people with 'matched marriages' still in love after 40 and 50 years.(they were free to decline, but they were introduced by an older relative)

I know people who are divorcing after 40 yrs of marriage.

It took me all my life to understand my own family system.

Older people either have the wounds suffered from or the victories over their family systems. They have either reached personal liberation or are still working toward it.

If there is any other way to understand a person other than looking into their family system, I would be glad to hear of it.

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 Re: Family systems
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-29-07 02:11


I guess there is more than one man who could say his wife was movie-star good looking but the undercurrent of her upstream family system was a force of energy waiting for disaster .

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 Re: Family systems
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-29-07 02:13

Looks, education and profession ain't everything.

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 Re: Family systems
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-29-07 03:00

Looks, education, profession and great sex ain't everything.

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 Re: Family systems
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-29-07 03:32

Much money and 1-2-3 children later.... like I've said, it's ok for a man to cry and cry a river.


* look out for the mask of sanity, which is the title of a book on psychopaths, by Hervey Cleckley, M.D. 'MASK OF SANITY' -

On the other hand I have a male relative who married a wonderful lady from a Puerto Rican family.

It is a large, warm family system. They live in homes close to each other.
Some of the houses are separate dwellings on each floor with different relatives on each floor.

There is always a birthday, anniversary, wedding to celebrate. The gatherings are huge.

The parental house is a constant informal flow of relatives. Life is open, celebratory, participatory. Sorrow and tragedy are communal.
There are no hidden hooks. No isolation and loneliness.

May all young men desiring wives be similarly blessed.

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 choice
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-29-07 13:07

Dear Joy,

At this juncture of my life, finding a partner ranks lowest amongst my concerns. In that regard, I suppose one could wait.

At present, I am confronted with a difficult personal decision (between investment banking or furthering my studies). This is a decision with consequences stretching over a significant span of what remains of my youth. I have seen how unforgiving life is to people who have made the wrong choices, and I intend to tread carefully. Both choices entail a significant risk of failure.

My parents fear that if I further my studies to the extent of pursuing a PhD, this will totally shipwreck my chances of commercial success. I wonder to what extent this is true. If I opt to do my PhD, I should be a Dr. by 29 (assuming all goes well). My parents think the whole idea is a waste of time.

I have calculated that if I were to succeed in my investment banking career, I would be a division head/senior manager/vice president by 29. This means handling difficult clients, making routine phone calls, supervising my colleagues' work, doing presentations and proposals. Hardly the sort of life I want to lead. Glamourous, but hey, hardly groundbreaking from an intellectual perspective.

What makes this decision so heart-wrenching is that the investment bank happens to have a good "name". I think my parents would scream if I were to reject their offer. Then again, the university that offered me a chance to further my studies has "pedigree" too, but my parents feel there is no value added, as my previous uni already had some "pedigree". They think I'm going to be throwing away a good opportunity, especially since getting through an investment banking interview is like winning a rare lottery ticket (none of my ethnic Chinese colleagues from the LSE actually made it into one).

My parents don't seem to understand that the job market of the 21st century exhibits far more mobility. There are so many banks out there, I could always try for an investment banking career. But right now, at 25, I feel I need intellectual stretching - a life of diversity and contemplation.

I don't want to have to do my PhD when I'm 60. And I know I could never feel fulfilled with climbing the corporate ladder.

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 Re: choice
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-29-07 21:31

Dear Mr. Liao,

What fine folks your parents are and what a capable person they raised. Kudos to them.

You are right. Marriage is not a priority for a man who is 25 years old.

Seems you are at a fork in the road, Mr. Liao, with two professional options facing you. You say that either alternative contains a 'significant risk of failure'. Do you really think so, Mr. Liao. You? Fail? I mean either path is not a cakewalk, but it is plain that you have the ability to accomplish either of the two challenges. So dare I tell a Risk Analyst that the risk of his failure in either path is extremely , extremely low?

A prestigous investment banking firm offered you a rarely offered interview which none of your peers were offered. If you follow that path, climb the corporate ladder of investment banking - which you could do very well - you say it would not ultimately be fullfilling to you.

In 4 more years at this prestigious investment banking firm you would be a vice president doing presentations, proposals, supervising the work of a department of colleagues. Financially, this appears to be a more lucrative avenue but the rub is that once you have climbed to this mountain top, you believe that you will not feel fulfilled.

However, your parents would really love you to follow the investment banking career in this prestigious firm.

The other option is to spend the next 4 years pursuing a PhD at a pedigree university which your parents think would be a waste of time since you already have a stellar academic record from a pedigree university.

Your parents think the investment banking opportunity is a better choice.. They would be most disappointed if you do not follow the investment banking opportunity especially as that firm has a fine reputation. They would 'scream' if you decline the offer ! You, however, want to be stretched and have a desire for intellectual stimulation and contemplation. Your druthers would be to go for the PhD, quite opposite from your parents' wishes.

You seem to feel that if you acquire a PhD, the mobility of the job market in investment banking will still allow you to regain re-entry. Your parents feel you will miss the opportunity to enter the industry. However, I gather that you intend to pursue a PhD at some point in yr life, sooner or later. It is not a question of 'if' you will pursue a PhD, but rather 'when' you will pursue a PhD. A PhD would help you to feel 'complete' in a certain kind of way.

Your great advantage is your youth.

I think you can have BOTH options, just not simultaneously, but in sequence.

If you do the PhD first, then by 35 or before 35 you can experience your corporate ladder success. After that if you do not feel completely fulfilled, (goal posts always move don't they ?) perhaps you can look into social causes if that rings any bells for you....there are children and adults who want to be taught math, abused women who need financial advice...volunteering is one way to add meaning to one's life ...OR of course venturing into the expression of personal interests that call to your inner self ...things you have always wanted to do for instance in sports, music, art, nature, horticulture, mountaineering ..whatever etc...or a career move..(politics?)

At 25 and 30 a serious 'wrong choice' seems unlikely to me.

The nagging question is which one you prefer .

Listen to your own heart...which is indicating, to me from reading your post, the hankering for pursuing the PhD

PERSONAL COMMENT
* I have made wrong choices , ( the major one not of my conscious choice was to be born into my specific family system - major cosmic turn but my cosmic debt now fully paid. The next wong choice one was to marry the wrong man ) but I am now at the happiest point in my life.

I have just gifted some personal assets which I regarded as my startover nest egg, leaving myself financially vulnerable but very happy and free... it was not the logical thing but the right cosmic thing and the right heart-thing to do . I am 59, but feel free and 'strong' compared to the former me... so what is the unforgiving consequence of bad choices you are talking about? I am fully confident that my financial vacuum will be refilled . It might fill up abundantly, perhaps surpassing what I had before since my palm is completely open , not clenching nor clutching a safe asset. I feel in tune with my spirit. But that is my path.


CONCLUSION TO LIAO
If the PhD path has resonance to your spirit, I don't see how you could lose. You have time to regain any commercial loss. In my view, time is on your side. If you do the PhD and do find it was a 'waste of time' would you have ENJOYED yourself pursuing it? Then, chalk it up to enjoyment or intellectual fulfillment. Time is on your side. Your parents will love you no matter what. Even they scream.


J ~

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Abdullah Abdurrahman 
Date:   07-30-07 01:43

I thought you have courted Jane pretty well and she is fine 28 years old noisy lady and rich. Aren’t those qualities you are after? Liao, man’s libido ends at 30 if not initiated. You are quite close to it I guess.

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Jane 
Date:   07-30-07 04:29

Abdullah,

Watch out what you say! You could get sued for what was not true. :)

(Can i post my love poems here and get some advice for how it is written?)

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 focus
Author: mr. liao 
Date:   07-30-07 17:15

Joy,

I was actually in the top 10% of my undergraduate class upon graduation, and also ranked 1st, out of 200 students (all with 1st class honours) during the first semester exam during my MSc for the microeconomics paper.

However, in the final Msc exam, I sort of did quite mediocrely. From 1st in the whole uni ---> average marks. This was entirely due to a preoccupation with existential questions - it was the first time in my life when I wasted a whole year.

I am a sort of unlucky person who has been known to convert victory into defeat, and lose focus in the most important of times.

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 Re: focus
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-30-07 18:22

Oh, so Liao that is where the risk factor comes in then?

Brilliant scores sometimes ( 1st out of 200 ) and then average scores sometimes.

Well, it is not bad, in my view that such a thing might happen.

What if you scored 1st all the time in a group of 1st class honor students? My God. You might think yourself infallible!

Whereas some people might say you should focus I think that during studies you should have parts of relaxation and fun (perhaps you already do ). I think , if it is your personality make up, that the parts which are funky need expression. I mean whatever is your equivalent of the 'rock band in the garage' thing...something you can dip into quickly without having to invest plenty serious group time , as coordinating groups take up a lot of time.

You like the intellectual life... me, I am getting stuff together to attend a first time beach campout..wondering if I will like it...set up tent, blow up air mattress, carry food, carry flashlight.......

"I am a sort of unlucky person who has been known to convert victory into defeat, and lose focus in the most important of times."

Exam results which determine success or failure after years of study drive me nuts. One's overall, consistent effort and results are important. The assignments one completes to demonstrate comprehension of the discipline should be weighted in the overall evaluation, plus oral-conversation/exam which demonstrates on the spot understanding of the problem.

Liao, the intellectuals on this forum should talk to you about how they focus/ed for exams - or recommend that their students focus.

I am afraid I would lead you down the wrong path suggesting you come to watch the sunset from the beach - where we will talk about cosmic stuff - or just gaze silently at the sunset.

Other people on this forum are better guides than me on how to focus for exams. Some are professional academics and have even set the questions for the exam papers and then graded the exam papers. Perhaps they may weigh in with helpful suggestions.

Most of all, I am glad to know you are not perfect, Liao. Very smart, yes, but not perfect ^<>^ (yet) LMHO.

Joy

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-30-07 18:27

Jane,

I am going to be switching gears soon and cannot indulge myself in love poems as I might have liked.

I hope you will find other people interested in reviewing your poems.

Best wishes.

Joy

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   08-01-07 21:34

Lets hear the Love poems of Jane. You are too young to stop painting your toe-nails.....neon lilac.... Joy!

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 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   08-02-07 20:41

erh......Joyyyyii ?

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 If
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-03-07 22:17

Dear Suen,

If you see a tallish man strolling at Victoria Peak or in the gardens near MacDonnell Road wish him well for me. He may be pondering the global issues of the world or looking people at doing tai chi or sneaking a peek at the toenail polish of young ladies - Raspberry Shimmer, Mint Julep, Mango Sherbet.

I am just a boring grandmother figuring out how to fold my tent back into it's package, how to squeeze a sleeping bag and an air mattress to its original size......

It is good to be young at heart. You and Jane.... You enjoy the cadences of love poems. Love is good for all seasons.

Keep well :-)

J ~

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 Re: If
Author: yewtai 
Date:   08-11-07 11:42

Try to go and live around near the poor people in China or India or Indonesia for a few days and then you will realise how lucky you are to have so many fortunate choices that doesn't make much of a different of your life in the future unless you produce some super duper idea that can change the whole world. Whether you follow plan A or B or C a gifted person like you will do very well in life and retire financially very comfortable. Your parents probably are wise and practical and they know what are the priorities in life you shoud strive for before you follow your heart.

Most of the bosses or managers (who are probably not intellectually inclined) in almost any companies are basically an ass....h.o.l.e , not because they want to be one but for their own career survival have to act like one. Actually they are only taking instruction from the top management and also acting on their own selfish interest. Basically some of these bosses are nice people and can be your good friend if you are not his rival in the same company.

Hey there is nothing special Dr.Andries is doing. He was probably one of those who designed the petrochemical and refinery plants for big oil companies in europe and america many years ago. Now he was called back to fix those pollution problems in the old petrochemical and refinery plants in order to comply with the new emmissions standards recently passed in europe and america, for these plant to continue operation for another 20-30 years. Too bad he is not willing to teach young people his know how unlike the japanese skill master.

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 hmmm
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-11-07 12:23

Hmm Yewtai,

Interesting comments.

About 'Dr. Andries', do we really know that he is unwilling to train young people or have we simply made an assumption?

If he really does nothing special, then why engage a person from so far away to relocate himself and mentor a team of locals? Why not find a local chap?

Respectfully,

J ~

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 Re: hmmm
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-11-07 18:25



"Dr. Andries" has collaborated in the translation of The Zen of Vegetable Roots, http://www.asiawind.com/art/caigentan/Default.htm

He has been assigned to work in China several times, has many Chinese friends and colleagues. He loves the Chinese culture.

It is a pity that sometimes we've maligned him on this forum.

If anyone thinks peace on earth is a desirable goal, then seek out your brother and spend time getting to know him. Just get to know, a little, one person you distrust or dislike, or whom you find irritating.

A high school administrative secretary, now in her 80s, told me recently of an older classmate , about 63 or so, an only child, who died alone after an extensive hospital stay. This classmate was an only child, unmarried, and her parents had long died.

The people who took her to the hospital and looked after her in the hospital for 8 weeks, besides the medical staff, were her neighbors, a husband and wife. This same husband and wife apparently are handling the astronomical medical bills and have handled her cremation. Donations have come in toward the medical bills.

Loving thy neighbor as thyself has truly been practised by those neighbors. I don't think I could have the same degree of fortitude.

The Persian word for neighbor is "hamsayeh' .....'ham -saw - yeh" which means, "sharing each other's shadow."

An internet person is not a neighbor . We don't have to depend on cyber friends for a jump start to a dead car battery or a dead telephone line. We don't share a common fence line or borrow tools from cyber correspondents. Tree limbs do not hang over from a cyberfriend's yard to ours, or ours to theirs.

We don't all have to agree and pretend to be harmonious and smiley faced, but perhaps the benefit of the doubt should be given to a forum participant unless there is evidence to the contrary.

Below is a reprint of Dr. S.L. Lee's comment to Andries and to me on April 21, 2005.


Re: Sino-Japanese Relations (Holland)
Author: SL Lee
Date: 04-21-05 14:12

Andries,

You are more Chinese than a lot of people with Chinese name but mind of something else. Not that Chinese should only mind Chinese, but Chinese as Chinese should be more global in perspective, because Chinese always call "Tian xia" (everything under the sky) as where we all dwell in.

Joy,

Andries is a good friend of all at Asiawind. He and his wife helped in the French, German and Spanich translation of a book by a Ming scholar.
--------------
SL Lee

_________

In my previous correspondence with Yewtai I have experienced nothing but cordiality and courtesy.


Respectfully,

J

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: If
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   08-11-07 22:43

If only I could have met you in the HK Botanical Garden before your mother shipped you off to Jamaica!
(But then you would have been only a toddler and I had eyes on 'other' things!)

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: If
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-11-07 23:29

Ha !

Suen there are lovely ladies in Hong Kong. That's for certain !
( Yes - I'd forgotten the name. They are called the Botanical Gardens)

It takes a while for a person's character to 'distill'. Lucky the man/woman who selects the right person when young. Two who would be as Coyote says, 'polished by adversity' together...because into every life and married life some rain must fall and love and characters and values and the concept of forgiveness are tested.

Some thing says there is a core of something comfortable if a woman does not select a man because of need or desperation but out of strength and calmness. Not out of need for excitement but companionship.

Such are the ramblings of a grandmother who mowed the lawn just before ir rained.

Be well, Suen.

J ~

Reply To This Message
 
 Rambling comments
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-12-07 05:19



I can assure any young lady that at every stage of life there are single men.

A friend's sister married for the first time at the age of 50.

A neighbor's first 2 husbands died. She is now 83. Her third husband, whom I thought was her first husband when I first met them recently, was a former priest who had known her for 50 years. This former priest had known the first two husbands. They have been married for 5 years. He resigned his priesthood. They are happly married. She says with a merry twinkle that he is like any man.

The woman who fixed my eyeglasses is 38. Never married. Her boyfriend dumped her 5 days before her last birthday. Within a 2 year span she had lost her mother, father, grandfather. She lives upstairs in a house. Her married sister lives downstairs. Her brother in law is very protective. She is enjoying her nieces and nephews and thinks that being aunt is fulfilling to her. I believe one day she will find her prince.

Mismanaged sex emotions create lots of confusion, chaos and trouble. The consequences are sometimes far reaching.

I have a young Jamaican man-friend. He is 40 years old. He does not have a girlfriend , nor a child. This in a country where males normally measure their status by the number of children they have fathered. However, he is determined not to have children ( or girlfriend ) until he can afford to provide for them.

Inspiring.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   08-12-07 13:54

Dear Joy,

Nice to hear from you. Indeed it is strange that some people judge without knowing. I will not repeat my possible achievements but want to state that my working is mainly focused on training young people. In China I had many young people in my teams and they are still asking my advice. The technology that I apply is not outdated but very up to date. The assumption that it is based on European environmental regulations is not correct. The current PRC standards are at least equal. The adherence is difficult due to the huge surfaces. The intention is there and China will play an important role in economy with full respect to the environment.

I hope to hear from you soon.

Kind regards,
Andries

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-12-07 15:33



Well, Andries, now we have the clarification. You do train young people.
Any 'old hand' is often entrusted with mentoring the young. It would be short sighted not to do so. If the young people are still asking your advice then it means you acted in a manner in which they felt comfortable, not embarrassed or intimidated by your experience, knowledge or attitude.

As to your achievements, they have been mentioned before. Some of them are:


*DDE in Fujian
*Development of the Kela2 gas field
*Designing the 4000 km pipeline from Lunnan to Shanghai with 12
booster compressor stations
*Conceptional and basic design of the first commercial coal liquefaction
plant in Inner Mongolia and implementation of SIL techniques in the
Sinopec engineering companies.
*Online consultant for the Shenhua coal company.
working full time on a project to replace steam turbines in an
ethylene plant to drive charge gas and propylene compressors"


I have always found Yewtai to be a very rational and reasonable person.
Let us forget about this. The matter has been clarified.

In the words of American poet and English professor at Arizona State University, ALBERTO RIOS:

"We are in a border time, the border between countries, between centuries, the border between yesterday and tomorrow, what we have been and what we are going to be. We are a state of many languages, many cultures."

RIOS grew up in a border town, son of a Mexican father and white mother. He always felt 'in between'. Thus his identifcation with borders.

I like it when he says we are at the 'border between yesterday and tomorrow, what we have been and what we are going to be.'

Nobody's is perfect. We are all changing constantly.

We are a world of many cultures, many languages. These are borders too.
We are all on one border or another. A border of understanding more, more.

Be well, Andries, and do take some time off to relax too.

Joy~

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Andries Zijlstra 
Date:   08-13-07 14:49

Dear Joy,

I'm surprised that you still know about my occupations in general and in China in particular. I think that some people don't know what it means to obtain a foreign expert certificate and a permanent resident permit in China. You have first to qualify scientifically and than pass a medical examination to assure that you are physically fit for it. Even Odile had to pass this medical examination to be allowed to stay in China. Anyhow I agree with you that the matter is over and done with unless somebody wants to have a discussion based on facts and not on assumptions. Indeed Yewtai used to be very reasonable and it is strange that such a potentially balanced person jumps to unsubstantiated conclusions.

Kind regards,
Andries

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-13-07 17:23

Hi Andries,

The power of internet records is wonderful. I could not repeat verbally what your achievements were, nor can I explain them, but I could find records ( laughing ) just as I could find Dr. Lee's post.

It is nice to have someone else display one's achievements although I know it could not have been a complete list. You also taught at the U of Delft at one time ( applied physics and thermo dynamics.) , I believe, then after 'retirement' you were a consultant on process control issues.

Delft is the town in Holland where they make blue and white handpainted porcelain ceramics known as DELFTWARE.

I appreciate that bureaucratic requirements for being allowed to enter and work in China and for your wife to accompany you were considerable.

From my brief visit to China in April- May 2006 I learned that a huge government such as China must have is able to keep tabs on many individuals' lives.

Therefore the entry of foreign workers, even at a scientific level, is carefully processed. The health issue is also carefully screened for, as you have said before, while you were there, SARS broke out and that was another major development with global consequences. No one wants contagious diseases in any country.

All work and no play is not too good, Andries. I hope you can spend some time enjoying the summer weather wherever you are.

I have read about Yewtai's achievements but I could not find that record. He is a very self directed person who has accomplished a great deal on his own.

Out here - beautiful sunny day !

Joy ~

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-23-07 10:49


Hello Joy. Glad to see that your learning curves still permit a little sojourn into Asiawind now and then.

Hello suen.kuen. I thought that Joy's preferred colour for her toenails was peacock blue. Or is it lightning lapis lazuli? *#!*! I knew that I should not have forgottten my Aricept when I was in China. Or was it Cognex? Exelon? Oh well!

Anyway it is good to be back, reading the latest posts by familiar forumites. Hello to one and all.

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Tom
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-23-07 22:29

Tom,

It is always nice to see you.

Joy

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   08-24-07 23:06

Hi Tom : Good to see you back up here.
At 57 I think Joy should experiment with all colors....neon lilac ,iridescent blue....peacock green.....or all 10 of 'em toes of hers .....different shades....flashing!
I am saying.....all wiped off and everyday nunnery au naturale speeds up the ageing process unnecessarily.
The Joy I have in mind is not like that. ;-)

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-25-07 00:12

My dear Suen,

I will be 60 this year. The big Six Oh. Never been happier. Time has been passing by while we have been acquainted on this forum.

One is never too old to be lighthearted and there is nothing wrong with rainbow toes.

No doubt I shall do things which raise the eyebrows of my granddaughters (now 2+ and 1+) as they grow up. On the whole I hope I will not embarrass them too much.


J ~

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-25-07 07:03

I now have a very vivid picture of all 10 flashing toe nails, suen.kuen! You are right. Let not age deter young grandmothers from neons and iridescent hues.

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: hmmm
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-25-07 07:08


Joy. With those rainbow flashing toe nails your granddaughters will think that they have the coolest grandmother in the universe!

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Tom
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-25-07 09:04

Peripatetic Tom,

Have you been travelling?

Joy - ( potemtial cool grandmother )

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Tom
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-28-07 10:13


To a potential cool grandmother - Joy.

Yes, have been enjoying a rather exhaustive 7 weeks in China. Was there when some foolhardy "travellers' staged a protest at EBC. In Chengdu, backpackers were saying that the local travel agents/guides who had helped those protesters organise their trip have "disappeared." There were also a lot of travellers who were refused a visa to Tibet and those who did possess a valid visa were denied entry. Travels and politics should not mix. I really feel for the local travel agents and guides. I pray that they are safe. What harm we do to the locals by trying to impose our self righteous yardstick without realising the dire implications and consequences. Not for us - for them. As in this case, the foreigners (protesters) were just deported. The locals (travel agents, guides) "disappeared."

Some bits and pieces I picked up. Thought they might be of interest.

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Tom
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-28-07 16:18

Hi Tom,

I had not heard of the incident(s) you mentioned...i.e. travellers entering China, demonstrating, and ultimately risking / hurting the local travel agents residing in the area, who had helped them.

It certainly is wise to be sensitive to the local culture, understanding the power dynamics of that area.

In a much different way, I was recently with a host and his dog in a car. The dog needed to be let out of the car to go to the bathroom. We drove around. It was a rural area. But my host, a long time resident of the area, knew that where we were poking around by car was an Indian reservation not general rural land and perchance letting out the dog to ''pee' on their reservation was witnessed, it might not have been well received by the native Indians who live on this island.

Such a 'small' thing like that is really a big thing. I was impressed that my friend was so in touch with the local culture.

Therefore your story about the protests organized by travellers is something to hear in mind.

What was the political protest about? A "free Tibet" protest?

Regards,

Joy

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Tom
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-31-07 06:23



Joy, I love your friend/host.

Yes, " free Tibet and reinstate the Dalai Lama."

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Tom
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-31-07 11:30


If local travel agents 'disappeared' for helping to organize FREE TIBET demonstrations, it is serious and sinister. So sorry, Tom.

Maybe when you are in the mood you will post photos of your latest travels, Tom.

J~

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Tom
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   09-10-07 09:28


Will do so Joy.

Regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Jane 
Date:   07-05-08 03:38

Dear Liao,

how have you been? was wondering of you... are you working or studying now?

jane

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: yewtai 
Date:   07-05-08 23:16

" I have always found Yewtai to be a very rational and reasonable person. "


Author: Tom Bombadil
Date: 08-31-07 06:23

Joy, I love your friend/host.

Yes, " free Tibet and reinstate the Dalai Lama."


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have always been very reasonable and rational in my analysis of most situation. Living in a SINKI hole here, you need to have some rational thinking and accept lifes many contradictions, unfairness and unreasonables.

However for this ass_hole old man Tom, I can only give him my most unreasonable response. It is almost unbelievable a very experienced, well travelled and well read old hack can support the global conman Diu Lama who knowingly and intentionally want to cause many more dead people in China and around the world. Is Tom brains have been programmed to only look from one side of the coin and incapable of looking at the big picture ? How stupid can Tom be ?

Tom is a typical white racist who talk with a fork tongue and with the mouth full of garbage. No amount of experience and religion teaching will alter his built in egoistic and arrogant mentality. His warmongering christian mentality have not changed since more than one thousand years ago.

Reply To This Message
 
 Hello Yewtai
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-07-08 23:29

( speaking gently, softly )

Dear Yewtai,

Please allow me to say I must protest. Tom is one of the gentlest people I have ever met. I must speak up for this kind man, Tom Bombadil.

If your political views differ from Tom's it does not make him a "racist" or ' @!#$." Being just to people with whom we differ, well, it's part of civil discourse.

I will copy and paste separately two differing views, by two different authors, about the Tibet debate. I was most interested to read them recently on Salon.com.

It argues, knowledgably I thought, about the Tibet conundrum. I have no points to add to their presentations. Their points were the most 'in-depth' I have encountered so far.

Best wishes. Stay well.

/J

Reply To This Message
 
 2 different arguments about Tibet
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   07-07-08 23:40

From www.salon.com.

EVERYONE NEEDS TO GET INFORMED THEN GET REAL by TaMu - July 1, 2008

I live in China and the Tibet situation is grossly misunderstood outside of China. Here's the reality.

Fact: The Chinese government does not care about Tibetans or their well-being.

The reason China annexed Tibet had nothing to do with all the propagandic Chinese rhetoric we hear today about Tibet having ALWAYS been a part of China throughout history, or that the Tibetans are Chinese, or that it was a benevolent act to liberate a backwards country. China annexed Tibet because Tibet is rich in natural resources that China wants. They cannot be shamed into changing their behavior towards Tibetans because they do not care about Tibetans. They care what's in the ground under the feet of Tibetans and what's in the mountains above the heads of Tibetans.

This is half the reason why the new railroad was built connecting Tibet to the rest of China. It's to get natural resources out.

Fact: The railroad runs in two directions.

In the last 60 years, the Han Chinese population of Tibet has grown from almost zero to over 40%. The Chinese government gives tax breaks and economic incentives to Han Chinese who relocate to Tibet. Simply put, the long term Chinese strategy is to reduce Tibetans to an insignificant minority in their own country. Aside from laying down on the train tracks (which would only result in Tibetans getting run over by trains), a strategy of non-violence by Tibetans cannot address this demographic shift.

Fact: Chinese people do not like Tibetans and are not sympathetic to their plight.

If you ask the average man on the street, the opinion of Han Chinese of Tibetans is that the Tibetans are lazy, untrustworthy, theiving, ungrateful, backwards animals. Han Chinese people hate Tibetans. Violent uprisings like the one this past spring elicit no emotions of sympathy whatsoever for the plight of Tibetans; they harden Chinese public opinion against Tibetans.

Fact: Beijing hates the Dali Lama and is actively subverting Tibetan Buddhism.

The Dali Lama is China's Osama Bin Laden. Every Chinese schoolchild is taught that he is an evil, splittist, depraved liar. Beijing will never deal with the Dali Lama. They may meet with him or his envoys, but the chances of some sort of agreement or resolution that would satisfy Tibetan grievances is zero. They'll wait for him to die and then appoint their own Dali Lama. They've already done this with the Panchen Lama. There is no chance of China reaching any kind of meaningful accord with the Dali Lama because his value as a target of propaganda outwieghs anything he can offer China. China will wait until he dies and then deal with the puppet Dali Lama they appoint themselves.

Fact: Tibetans are not prepared for an armed conflict.

The riots this spring were fought with fire, knives, and rocks. The PLA has a standing presence in Tibet and they're better armed, better trained, and have no qualms about turning their weapons against their own countrymen if need be. The stashes of weapons that the PLA has allegedly found in various monostaries are pathetically insufficient means to fight an armed conflict.

Fact: In the event of a sustained conflict between Tibetans and China, the Tibetans are on their own.

No country in the world is going to interfere in a conflict between Tibet and China. Not India, not the US, not the EU, not the UN (China is a veto-wielding member of the UN Security Council) not anyone. The idea that any foreign government would intervene in a conflict between Tibetans and China is simply wrong. They will pass congressional resolutions, they'll make statements, they'll invite the Dali Lama for another round of awards, but they will do nothing, if for no other reason than invading Tibet is a militarily logistical nightmare.

Fact: Free Tibet concerts, Olympic torch relay disruptions, and pressuring foreign governments to use diplomatic pressure are a waste of time.
These activities may make foreigners feel good, right, and moral, but they have the actual effect of hardening Chinese public opinion and governmental resolve against Tibet. China considers the Tibet situation to be an "internal affair", which to them means that it is not proper for foreigners to interfere. Any activity that China deems an "internal affair" (Tibet, Xinjiang, Taiwan) means that the Chinese do not care what foreigners think and do not want the help/criticism/suggestions of foreigners. If you don't believe how hysterical the Chinese are about their alleged "internal affairs", try convincing a mainland Chinese sometime that Taiwan is not presently a part of the People's Republic of China.

Fact: Tibetans are quickly reaching a point of desperation.
Tibetans are being bred out of their own country, disenfranchised politically, excluded economically, and abandoned by their religious leader who spends his time globetrotting and receiving awards from foreign governments. They have little to lose, since they've lost almost everything already. Their choice at this point is basically between burning out and fading away.

So, to sum up: Tibetans have been using nonviolence for decades, with the net result of unfavorable demographics and economic, political and religious disenfranchisement. When Tibetans do use violence, it has the net effect of hardening Chinese public opinion against Tibetans. Tibetans are not prepared to fight a conflict now, and they will be even more outnumbered and marginalized if they choose to fight in the future. When they do chose to fight, they will do it on their own. Free Tibet concerts and protests in foreign countries are a waste of time and adversely affect the Tibetans and their cause. The present strategy being used by Tibetans and foreign sympathizers has a net negative effect.

Free Tibet? Not a chance. Regardless of Tibet's history, Tibet is going to be a part of China for at least as long as the PRC exists and is run by the CCP, and probably a lot longer.


REBUTTAL of TaMu by NEIMING - July 2008


Fact: The Chinese government does not care about Tibetans or their well-being.

China annexed Tibet because Tibet is rich in natural resources that China wants. …

The reason Chinese government of any kind would annex Tibet is because if it does not, some other powers would. The geographic location of Tibet is such that if a hostile power occupies it, it can literarily break China apart at any time of its own choosing. Any Chinese government is compelled to make Tibet part of China if it is serious about the national survival.

Fact: The railroad runs in two directions.
In the last 60 years, the Han Chinese population of Tibet has grown from almost zero to over 40%.

The population of TAR (Tibetan Autonomous Region) is 92% Tibetan. I know Salon readers are not exactly well informed when it come the issue of China/Tibet. It does not mean you can just make it up figures as you like.

Fact: Chinese people do not like Tibetans and are not sympathetic to their plight.

Chinese people are prejudiced like people of all ethnicities are prejudiced. It is not pretty, but it is a fact. Another unpleasant fact is that compare to Chinese (whether Han or otherwise) all other people looked lazy. How do you think they managed to transform their economy in 30 year when the same feat took western powers over 200 years?

Fact: Beijing hates the Dali Lama and is actively subverting Tibetan Buddhism.

If you live in Beijing, visit Yong He Gong Tibetan Buddhist Temple. There you will learn that Buddhism in general, and Tibetan Buddhism in particular are thriving in China. There are over 40000 monks in Tibet, financially supported by a combination of government funding and private donation by Tibetan and Han Chinese alike, inside and outside of China. Chinese government’s vilification of Dalai Lama (which I think is grossly misguided) is for his political roles and stands, not his religious ones.

Fact: Tibetans are quickly reaching a point of desperation.
Tibetans are being bred out of their own country, disenfranchised politically, excluded economically, and abandoned by their religious leader who spends his time globetrotting and receiving awards from foreign governments.

Tibetans are unfortunately disenfranchised because they have a difficult time adapting to the new market economy. The reasons are extremely complex. There are certainly government failures and neglects. Most of Han migration into Tibet pre-1990s was a part of the government’s effort to build an education system from scratch. That effort had largely failed. The current migrants into Tibet are the entrepreneurial Han and Muslin Chinese escaping fierce competition in other more densely populated parts of China. These migrants tried and succeeded in getting a share of the large governmental financial investment intended for Tibetans. Their success is resented by the disenfranchised Tibetans in the same way that Korean shop owners in South Central LA were resented by African Americans during the Rodney King riot.

So, to sum up: Tibetans have been using nonviolence for decades, with the net result of unfavorable demographics and economic, political and religious disenfranchisement.

Dalai Lama and Tibetan exiles adopted the nonviolence AFTER a failed arm rebellion in 1959 and numerous other arm incursions founded CIA afterward. They also adopted the slogans of freedom, democracy and self-determination. They are very successful in purging much of the traditional (but demanding part) of Tibetan Buddhism from its public face to make it a quintessential new age religion. I am not here to question the sincerity in their transformation. I only wish to point out Tibet pre-1959 was not the exotica as is now being perceived in the west. In fact it was a theocratic serfdom. That old system existed for its own historical and geographical reasons, and on-doubt would have transformed to adapt to the modern society with or without communist takeover. But history need to be respected for its consequences, good or ill.

To sum up: Salon is not exactly the place for serious discussion on the issue of Tibet and China. The article itself is more of a philosophical argument. The Salon community is essentially an echo chamber on such alien issues. So, please go back to argue the latest Joan Walsh polemic instead.

_______

Political discussions belong to the World Forum. Please excuse these political posts on the Life Forum. I am only responding to the topic raised by our friend Yewtai and will now take my leave.

Regards to All.

/j

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   07-08-08 06:12



''I have always found yewtai to be a rational and reasonable person. "

Careful yewtai, you are in danger of toppling that crown if you do not read ALL the posts that led up to that statement on 08.31.07. It was an ANSWER to a question in the lead up from posts dated 08.28.07 to 08.31.07.

With regards
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Hello Yewtai
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   07-08-08 07:02


Dear gently, softly spoken Joy,

We were just "philosophising'' that travel and politics should be 2 totally different entities and because the posts leading up to that ''íncendiary'' answer were carelessly ignored........

Politics and religion are best left alone because a single difference of opinion can make a relatively rational and reasonable person not very rational and reasonable after all.

When I travel, I appreciate the awesome beauty, the tranquility, the smiles, the unforgettable hospitality. Was in Zhongdian when the riots broke out in Lasa. Busloads of police in full riot gear in the city. On the way to Deqin, there were at least 2 military checkpoints. Locals stay on the bus. Foreigners have to disembark to have their papers verified. All in a day's travel. No politics.

Warm regards,
Tom

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-08-08 08:59

Tom was reporting what he had seen, not indicating his support. See how you puked all over yourself for nothing.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: yewtai 
Date:   07-12-08 08:44

Tom still has the built-in warmongering impulsive emotional response who talk without using his brains which is typical of all WASP racist ass_hole. He has a brain which was programmed not to think of the consequences of his statement. If you talk like that in Singapore you will be fire left and right and get hauled up in court. Reporting what you see and writing what you feel like without a thought of the consequences of your statement to others is a very very irresponsible behavior. You need to read and understand deeply what was written by hohoyan who has given a very fair evaluation on Diulama.

Old man Tom, this is an open forum whether categorise into political or not is not important and there are thousands of readers in this forum daily.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-28-08 14:11

Previously you misread. Now you maligned. Degradation in progress...

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: yewtai 
Date:   07-30-08 05:20

Old man, I did not misread. I am only practically talking about the impact on others who just read that statement. You still didn't got it old bookworm.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: coyote 
Date:   07-30-08 15:35

"impact on others"?

Tom isn't responsible for any obstinate fool who misreads, misfires and refuses to act with minimal grace.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Catch up with old friends
Author: yewtai 
Date:   08-02-08 10:50

An old fool like you who have no real life experience think being irresponsible is the ultimate freedom of speech which all the western wannabes cherish most, will soon hit a wall when real life facts are laid in front of him and he has no answer for it.

Reply To This Message
 
 Bewildered
Author: Joy Living 
Date:   08-02-08 14:14

Yewtai,

Tom is the last person on earth to deserve such attacks. I presume when you keep referring to 'old man' you mean Tom Bombadil.

The more you utter such irresponsible words, the less credible you appear.

It bewilders me. Where is the rational and reasonable Yewtai I corresponded with a few years ago?

Tom is a circumspect man - the most circumspect visitor to AW - who is never involved in a controversy.

I am bewildered by your invectives against Tom. They are 100% unjust and undeserved.

Do consider that directing and conserving your energy for the real villains of the world may be a better investment of your time.

/J

Reply To This Message
 
 Dear coyote & Joy
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-03-08 04:54


coyote is the avuncular voice of reason and Joy is the perplexed voice of bewilderment. yewtai is on a hubris kamikaze mission. He can't hear us.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Dear coyote & Joy
Author: yewtai 
Date:   08-04-08 07:46


Author: Tom Bombadil
Date: 08-31-07 06:23



Joy, I love your friend/host.

Yes, " free Tibet and reinstate the Dalai Lama."

Regards
Tom


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Did you intentionally put up those words or not ? Don't pretend to be an ignorant and naive fools? Did all whiteman like to talk with fork tongue ?

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Dear coyote & Joy
Author: platypus 
Date:   08-04-08 08:08

Yewtai:

This is how I read Tom's post in its context:

First sentence: Tom was saying that he liked Joy's host/friend because s/he was sensitive to the native's way.

Second sentence: Tom earlier reported that he ran into foreign travellers in China who knowingly stirred up trouble, and in the process dragged innocent Chinese tour guides into trouble. As for the cause of the instigators? It was "free Tibet and reinstate the Dalai Lama."

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 Re: Dear coyote & Joy
Author: Tom Bombadil 
Date:   08-05-08 08:54


Thank YOU, platypus.

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 Re: Dear coyote & Joy
Author: yewtai 
Date:   08-08-08 14:39

You are a naive and ignorant fool. I don't think he mean it that way. If you read between the lines and how he spread his message, he intentionally or unintentionally try to show his true feelings with regards towards his views on the De-lama. If he think that I or others may have misread his intentions, he would have immediate deny his above statement and quickly apologise which he did not even care to. His true feelings and real intention was exposed without him knowing it. He detest the Chinese people and wish all the Chinese people go to hell.

If you make such statement in Singapore like that and replace it with Singapore, you will be heading for trouble with the authorities, and those authorities are only looking at the one statement which you wrote and will not care what views positive views you hold in the past. So be real becareful when you wrote such thing in for public consumption. Anyway arrogant whiteman who talk with croutch tongue seldom admit their mistake, especially those who are born with a silver spoon.

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