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 Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Liang2a 
Date:   03-05-12 22:02

Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?

It looks like Putin is re-elected the president of Russia. This has been widely expected. With Putin re-elected it is likely that Russia will now turn even further away from accommodation with the West or be evenmore confrontational with the US. It seems the wheel has gone a full cycle.

When Gorbachev collapsed the USSR it ushered in 2 decades of collapse and downward spiral. From all accounts Russia became a nation dominated by thugs who gained control of the natural resources especially oil and gas. And its military had deteriorated with no new generation of weapons being developed. They only try to sell as many of their older technologies developed during the USSR era such as Su-27 and its derivatives such as Su-30. Even their new 5th generation fightr has been universally rated as inferior to China's J-20. The only high tech thing Russia now sells that China want to buy are its jet engines. And with the Chinese jet engines mproving raidly such as WS-10, WS-15, etc. it will be soon when China can be fully self-sufficient in all its miltary technologies and need no longer to buy anything from Russia.

But this does not mean Russia is not of vital importance to China. It is obvious that China and Russia are both of the greatest importance to each other. When Gorbachev shifted to the West in the 1980's it quickly collapsed the USSR. China fought a war against Vietnam in 1979 as a proxy against USSR. And within some 10 years the USSR collapsed. When Putin first came to power he started Russia on its way ackup. But after Medvedev became president he shifted Russia to the West again. And again Russi underwent another period of decline. So now that Putin is back again in control of Russia it is likely that China and Russia will again improve their relationship.

China and Russia are back to back geographically. China's threat is from the east while Russia's threat is from the west. It is logical that they protect each other's back thus assuring security for each other. Russia also has vast natural resources such as timber and other minerals while China will increasingly be able to advance its indigenous technologies and produce all the consumer goods in the world especially high end electroic consumer goods that Russian consumers would like to have. And while China is demonized and marginalized by the West, Russia is also marinalized by the West. If either try to join the Western Club it will be treated as inferior. But if China and Russia can forge a strong strategic partnership then both will be very important to each othe and to the rest of the world. Therefore, based on economics, military security and national honor and prestige it is natural for China and Russia to forge a strong bond.

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: observer 
Date:   03-06-12 01:02

I agree with your views. It is gratifying to know that unlike erstwhile days when the Soviet Union was the 'big brother', the new relationship between the two countries is that of equals.

It is also gratifying to know that the US/EU had mishandled its foreign policy towards Russia. After the demise of the Soviet Union, the West should have disbanded NATO and help Russia economically. Instead it embarked on a insatiable expansion right to the Ukraine, in Russia's backyard. Russia's future lies with better relations with China.

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: hohoyan888 
Date:   03-06-12 12:11

What a stupid move by H. Clinton. Putin still has quite a few big bombs in his pocket. Why you want to upset him ?

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-06-12 13:40

I love to see the strongest bond between China and Russia -- better than the US and Canada:) Without oneside feeling whimpy :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-06-12 13:46

Like it or not, Russia can use the extra man power from China to make a solid industrial base in Eastern Russia -- Fear not of the Chinese --- fear none :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-06-12 13:49

Putin or no Putin, no Russian can ever be trusting Americans and their Jewish bosses ever again :) I am certain of that -- that half Jewish side of Hillary is showing -- who she really is . I think her other Jewish half has been bought and paid for by the network of the Rothschild group and their descendants , who is to know, by now , she seems to be in beed with that Zionist -- Netanyahu ... :) for more wars.

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   03-06-12 15:12

Let me first declare that I have no detailed knowledge of Russian history and culture; unlike say Chinese history, English history, European history or ancient history of the Romans and the Greeks or U.S. history [and even then mainly on the Civil War, because of my fascination with Abraham Lincoln and my quest to find out how a Christian can accept slavery, and the WWI to post WWII period, because of my fascination with Franklin Roosevelt and Harry Truman (my pet believe that an educated farmer makes the best leaders]. I am hopeless, a total ignoramus when it comes to South American and African history.

What I do know is that the Russians see and identify themselves as ‘white' and European, although the rest of the Europeans see them as 'uncouth' and 'less civilised' than themselves. The Russians also bear the same genetic 'colonialist' or 'imperialistic' tendencies of the 'white man'. The fact that they cling to Siberia and the Far East, when this vast expanse remain a 'relic' of their past and are in no way 'European' in any shape culture or form. Few ever take up the point that the Russians treat the natives of these steppe and tundra lands like the 'white man' in America treated or still treat the native Indians. If there is any 'religion' to claim as Russian it would be the Russian Orthodox Church [and nobody corrupted Christianity more than St Paul, a Greek Jew].

That is the general background. Now to some salient facts that have triggered many of the recent conflicts in modern times and is still in play.

It was the historical fact of attempts to subdue or conquer Russia by the Europeans, [refresh yourself on Napoleon and Hitler], the mantle of which unfortunately passed on to the Yanks, that led to or instigated the Cold War. The Russians instigated the Korean War by inciting North Korea to invade the South. China only came in when MacArthur crossed the Yalu River!

That led to a gross misunderstanding of the Yanks treating Communism as all the same. As MacArthur said – “They are all the same! Let us bomb the hell out of them.”.; when he wanted President Truman to put a few atomic bombs over China, so as to gain victory in the Korean War. But as the Mafioso will say – “Oils ain’t oils!” Chinese communism is communism with Chinese characteristics; Mao and Zhou and most of the other leaders were well read in the Chinese classics. The Chinese have a 5000+ continuing culture. The Russians [like the Yanks] were and are just ‘young lads’ in this sense. Tainted with the same brush, there was derivative or surrogate Cold War [against the Chinese] when the Yanks got involved in Vietnam, when the French could not manage the fight for independence by Uncle Ho.

I hope the Yanks now see the Chinese communists in a different light and as a different brand from the Soviet communists.

China should of course continue past friendship with Russia, despite the lack of help from Russia in the past when help was needed, or being stabbed in the back a few times. But China should do so as a ‘neighbour’ and more importantly, as an ‘equal’. China must know when not to get involved in the continuing Cold War between the Yanks and the Russians. China should remain guided by the Three Pillars of Society. With so many Chinese now living as Americans [compared with Chinese living as Russians; and in fact a Chinese would not be treated as equally in Russia as he would be in the U.S. of A.], this should help with better understanding, if the Chow Lees of this world can see the ‘helicopter’ view! The Russians are not Asians; and an Asian person is not so highly regarded in Russia as the multitude of well to do and successful Asians in the U.S. of A. In fact, if you are Chinese, you will definitely feel more at home in Yankee Land than in Russia. At least in the U.S. we can get to sing Elvis and do ‘rap’ and have Chinese food there as good as in Hongkong and Taipei, and shop for designer clothes that we can buy for our grandchildren. And, you have Chinatowns in every big city in Yankee land!

So, before we all start being too pro-Russian, take a simple step – see how far you can go in making friends with a Russian, have a meal with him, go to a karaoke with him, play golf with him, see his tastes in food and clothing, talk to him about Buddhism, talk to him about Christianity or Hinduism. An American may have a biased broad mind but a Russian usually has a stubborn narrow mind! Be careful!

CHC
7/3/12

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   03-06-12 17:46

Interesting...you claim nature, not nurture.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Liang2a 
Date:   03-06-12 23:19

Author: cheok hong chuan
Date: 03-06-12 15:12
So, before we all start being too pro-Russian, take a simple step – see how far you can go in making friends with a Russian, have a meal with him, go to a karaoke with him, play golf with him, see his tastes in food and clothing, talk to him about Buddhism, talk to him about Christianity or Hinduism. An American may have a biased broad mind but a Russian usually has a stubborn narrow mind! Be careful!
======================

Liang's response:
You have made a few good points. Nevertheless, it is the Yanks who are more dangerous to the Chinese now than the Russians. It is America that has the mindset and the military to take down China. China was betrayed by the Russians that is true. But there were no major wars between the Chinese and the Russians that I'm aware of. The biggest "conflict" between the Chinese and the Russians was over a small island in the middle of a river. In comparison with what the Japanese or the Americans had done to the Chinese the difference is like that between a sprained ankle and a cut off limb.

As I said before, there is mutual advantage for China and Russia to watch out for each other's back. Certainly, China can manage Russia much easier than it can manage America. Russia is becoming a little bear while the American eagle can still be deadly. Just look at the problems the Americans are causing in the S. China Sea.

In the end, China must be self-reliant and not depend on any foreigners. Always assume that the foreigners are up to no good. But it is also smart to make the best alliance possible for the time. And for the foreseeable future Russia is more beneficial to China than America. Russia is of little threat while America is very much a deadly threat. Just remember the Chinese kid who got beaten up and had to run for his life barefoot in the snow and ice in Chicago or somewhere. In America anybody who talk about establishing good relations with China is automatically branded a traitor to America. Nobody in Russia think it is traitorous to Russia to talk about establishing good relationship between China and Russia. This is the big difference. And as China get stronger the perception of the Russians toward the Chinese will change with greater respect and admiration. Already the Russians are treating the Chinese with much more respect than the Americans are treating the Chinese.

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   03-07-12 14:04

Liang,

You said - 'In the end, China must be self-reliant and not depend on any foreigners. Always assume that the foreigners are up to no good.'

You are a wise man. A wise China must keep a card up its sleeve. We are caught between a devil and the deep blue sea.

China should see that both Russia and US have a 'white' mentality. The US sees Russia as a greater threat than China. You say that China sees US as a greater threat than Russia. But that is how life is, all external perceptions!

I say that China should watch its front and back, as most of us Chinese who have been in the private sector know what I am talking about. We should be 'inscrutable' in the Chinese way; friendly dialogue and trade with all in public view, but in private 'trust no one'.

My dad taught me this lesson when I was young. On the outside in public maintain decorum and harmony, for you will be respected and trusted; but inside your heart, trust no one! Why? I asked. Tell me? Can you trust yourself to make the right decision? Can you trust yourself not to be tempted by naked women, money or power? Within yourself, trust no one because you cannot even trust yourself! Certain things you keep within your ‘heart’. And, when you deal with matters of the ‘heart’, be wise!

The perception you have of the U.S. is all ‘political’ and ‘psychological’ perception. Do not judge a book by its cover. Its all show only, for the U.S. is a peacock! It is just an inferiority complex that it has that somehow takes on a peculiar expression when it comes to elections and global granstanding. At the same time every single American business man I have ever dealt with have total respect and in awe of the assidiousness, the cleverness of the Chinese students, the ability and capability of the Chinese citizens and residents in the U.S., let alone in China or the rest of the Far East! If the U.S. should ‘fear’ us, they also ‘respect’ us for our integrity and ‘track record’ as a people.

We have a 'psyche' problem here in terms of ‘relationship’. If we are all became 'bananas', the U.S. fear for China will rapidly dissipate. That is the enigma that is and has always been for Gweilos cannot understand when we stubbornly and recalcitrantly like to remain 'ancient' Chinese in culture and philosophy!

Still, we should continue to practise the Middle Way of the Tao, and bend like bamboo in the breeze, survive by being ourselves, the Middle Kingdom, like a giant Switzerland, wishing well for the entire world, against hegemony of any kind, be it capitalism or communism or whatever 'ism'. We do not want the world to be ‘Chinese’ beyond the Middle Kingdom.

At the end of the day, I am very anti-American, I am against their 'world sheriff' attitude and their 'condescending 'white man' attitude; but I certainly feel very much ‘at home’ when I visit the U.S. Going on what my friends who have done business in Russia have related to me, they never ever felt ‘at home’ in Russia. Maybe we all have Elvis and 'rock and roll' and 'Hotel California' and our Westrn education to blame. Yet relatives who are not Western educated still like to migrate to the U.S.; it is still ‘Kum Shan’ to them. We ‘hate’ but ‘love’ the U.S.! They feel the same way. For that reason, no Chinese troops will ever land in the U.S. nor conversely any troops will land in China. We are almost ‘husband’ and ‘wife’ in a less than ideal marriage.

I respect you if you hold different views, but I hope I have explained myself, so that you may understand why for someone who is anti-U.S. imperialism is none the less a ‘friend’ of the U.S. I do not like what their leaders or some of their citizens think or do; but I see them as a family. At the ‘personal’ and ‘business’ relationship level I have enjoyed every trip I have made to the U.S.

CHC
8/3/12

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-07-12 16:14

Dear Cheok Hong Chuan .. Amongst most of the Westerners -- by both Benjamin Franklin and Jefferson 's personal stay in Europe, and be that France or UK ....

From day one these two American nation founders had their distrust over the Banks .. and I think they both were wise .. and I do highlight one of the best statements of Thomas Jefferson amongst the many ..

"Commerce with all ... Alliance with none ." And China while we will be engage all , including the West -- be we need to keep both our eyes opened -- more than, that if eyes are just two of the orifices -- then keep all the "7 holes" all open and be in the alert :) I am that cautious and alert -- :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   03-07-12 16:26

Paul Yih,

I am so glad that you agree with me.

Again you are one person that appreciates what I am suggesting about the Middle Way of the Tao.

Good that you found that quote from T. Jefferson - so very Chinese way of thinking.

Yes, trade with all but keep both eyes open and watch our front and back. Be on the alert! A friend today could be an enemy tomorrow and vice-versa! No alliances but friendly relationship and open dialogue.

Nobody wins in a war. Every soldier killed has a father and a mother and friends and siblings.

Also as the U.S. has found ou,t good money is wasted; that could have gone to better economic use. Why burn money?

CHC
8/3/12

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-07-12 18:30

yes, watch the American history..

Thomas Jefferson wanted to aided the Frenh...with the French Revolution and yet, impeded by Washington....

Jefferson.knew long ago, of the Rothschil end game.....He knew how King George was supplied by the Rothschil' German Hessian arme mercenary.....

every time, English. Knew how to bing the Americans and let US eat crow..

be tat Thatcher and Reagan
Clinton and Blair,
bushand Blair......

Churchill and Roosvelt.... the English jerked off the Americans for a false ego...and got the American into. A mess was,,,,In the meantime.. The usury bankers. Axe tons of money along with the MIC. the Military Industrial Complex....

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: charles koon 
Date:   03-08-12 05:26

""What a stupid move by H. Clinton. Putin still has quite a few big bombs in his pocket. Why you want to upset him ?""


Ever since she has let her hair down, her true colour is gradually emerging commensurately.

关 红 星

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: charles koon 
Date:   03-08-12 05:32

Such polarisation is inevitable given that both Russia and China are being destabilised by the sole world hegemon. It is US own making.

关 红 星

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 thomas jefferson words of wisdom for china!
Author: mr. bean 
Date:   03-08-12 08:12

paul those words of thomas jefferson are golden and should be framed in the offices in all of china's senior leaders because that is what china should do. but i would like to add a little modification.

"commerce with all .......alliance OR EMEMIES with none".

how about that?

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 Re: thomas jefferson words of wisdom for china!
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-08-12 17:06

Excellent --- Mr. Bean, I love that ...

The Americans, wise Americans like Thomas Jefferson from day one knew of the Rothschild and amongst the first American bastards who had pimped for Rothschild was Alexander Hamilton .. who came into being with total obscurities from the Caribbean ..

One more reminder to you all, the Rothschild , in being Jewish and with their own total sense of Racism and the practice of Economic Racism , they cared not who they kill or had killed, for as long as there is a profit for them ..and war or wars have been most profitable for the Rotshchild group and remember well, as of today, their network group are beyond their name only, from the Rockefeller to the state of Israel and to all the pimps they used to own like JP Morgan, to day's US Congress as their @!#$ to the more pimps -- who work the US Lobby and more ---- So, in my observation , when King George the third, or the dirt had tried to send in the Rothschild's German Hessian troops to fight the American colonies, when that had failed, King George and his Jewish advisers and their bankers, be that the Bank of England, the East Indian Company had sent so called McCarthy to China to pay respect to Emperor Qinlong, and on that six month trip , he actually were scouting all of China for the potential looting of all China - and as of late, the Opium Holocaust had started by the two families, the Rothschild and their inlaws, the Sassoon , Jews from Baghdad .. and over almost two hundred years of dominance in China with tons of inequality treaties , over 100 million dead Chinese by way of Opium --- and over 227.000 tons of silver had been extruded out of China ..

These markings of ruination of China (not to place the only blame of these merchant Jews who managed to pimp English to fight their wars and shared their loots -- from the opium gains in China, to the golds in then Rhodesia and diamonds in Africa -- and India -- )

For us all Chinese have to bear in mind as to who had China raped -- with full evidence of all the Jew Buildings on to the Bund in Shanghai and in HK and much more..

Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin had fought against the Jew bank money into US for the longest time , including Lincoln, Garfield and Kennedy --and many US presidents have been assassinated -- mostly because of the influence of these usury bankers and how they have created even Federal Reserve, which is not a government entity and the printing of the dollar like toilet papers ...

China has to be watchful of all these excess of worthless dollar -- and be alert -- and more direct currency exchange with Turkey is good, maybe even all nations including Brazil - and stay clear out of both Dollar and Euro , or do so with the minimum exposure ...

Thomas Jefferson 's brilliant mind can be observed by all Chinese ..

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-08-12 18:17

She is finally reivealing that she is half of a zionist by biology and a full zionist bigot in mind and in body :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Putin re-elected - stronger bond with China to follow?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   03-08-12 18:19

China and Russia can no longer be manipulated much less to be lied to -- those western emperors are now seemed naked -- when the tidal wave is down :) War for profit is no longer a viable money making game -- but those usury bank gangsters will dream up something soon -- They still think the world are full of ignorant idiots and fools -- like those inbred sovereign @!#$ and pimps they used to have for the past five hundred years . No more -- Not in Asia any more :)

Paul Yih

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