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 Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-21-12 14:00

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/12/opinion/sunday/is-china-ripe-for-a-revolution.html?_r=1&ref=china

NYT dated 2/12/12


"ONE HUNDRED years ago, on Feb. 12, 1912, the 6-year-old child emperor of the Qing Dynasty abdicated, ending more than 2,000 years of imperial rule in China. But this watershed moment for modern China will not be widely celebrated in the People’s Republic. The political climate in Beijing is tense as the ruling Communist Party prepares for a secretive transition to the next generation of leaders, with the untested vice president, Xi Jinping, expected to become president. Reminders of past regime change and the end of dynasties are not welcome.

Of course, the current government has little to fear from the example of 1912. The Qing Dynasty, founded in 1644 by Manchu tribesmen who conquered China from the north, was brought down by a highly organized revolutionary movement with overseas arms and financing and a coherent governing ideology based on republican nationalism. The Communist Party today faces nothing like that.

What it does face, however, is enormous, inchoate rural unrest. The dark side of China’s economic rise has been a shocking widening of the gulf between the prosperous coast and the poverty-stricken interior, a flourishing of corruption among local officials and, by such data as we can gather, widespread anger and discontent. The government has acknowledged tens of thousands of yearly “mass incidents,” which can range anywhere from a handful of elderly widows protesting a corrupt real estate grab to communities in open revolt (like the southern village of Wukan) to murderous ethnic rioting, as occurred in the last few years among Tibetans and in western Xinjiang Province and Inner Mongolia.

In that sense, it is instead the Taiping Rebellion, which nearly toppled the Qing Dynasty 50 years earlier, that bears the strongest warnings for the current government. The revolt, which claimed at least 20 million lives before it was quelled, making it the bloodiest civil war in history, suggests caution for those who hope for a popular uprising — a Chinese Spring — today.

The Taiping Rebellion exploded out of southern China during the early 1850s in a period marked, as now, by economic dislocation, corruption and a moral vacuum. Rural poverty abounded; local officials were wildly corrupt; the Beijing government was so distant as to barely seem to exist. The uprising was set off by bloody ethnic feuds between Cantonese-speaking Chinese and the minority Hakkas over land rights. Many Hakkas had joined a growing religious cult built around a visionary named Hong Xiuquan, who believed himself to be the younger brother of Jesus Christ. When local Qing officials took the side of the Chinese farmers, they provoked the Hakkas — and their religious sect — to take up arms and turn against the government.

What was so remarkable, and so troubling, about the Taiping Rebellion was that it spread with such swiftness and spontaneity. It did not depend on years of preliminary “revolutionary” groundwork (as did the revolution that toppled the monarchy in 1912 or the 1949 revolution that brought the Communists to power). And while Hong’s religious followers formed its core, once the sect broke out of its imperial cordon and marched north, it swept up hundreds of thousands of other peasants along the way — multitudes who had their own separate miseries and grievances and saw nothing to lose by joining the revolt. Out-of-work miners, poor farmers, criminal gangs and all manner of other malcontents folded into the larger army, which by 1853 numbered half a million recruits and conscripts. The Taiping captured the city of Nanjing that year, massacred its entire Manchu population and held the city as their capital and base for 11 years until the civil war ended.

SCHOOLCHILDREN in China in the 1950s and ’60s were taught that the Taiping were the precursors of the Communist Party, with Hong as Mao’s spiritual ancestor. That analogy has now fallen by the wayside, for China’s government is no longer in any sense revolutionary. So it makes sense that in recent years, the Taiping have often been depicted negatively, as perpetrators of superstition and sectarian violence and a threat to social order. The Chinese general who suppressed them, Zeng Guofan, was for generations reviled as a traitor to his race for supporting the Manchus but has now been redeemed. Today he is one of China’s most popular historical figures, a model of steadfast Confucian loyalty and self-discipline. Conveniently for the state, his primary contribution to China’s history was the merciless crushing of violent dissent.

Beijing has learned its lessons from the past. We see this in the swift and ruthless suppression of @!#$ and other religious sects that resemble the Taiping before they became militarized. We can see it in the numbers of today’s “mass incidents.” One estimate, 180,000 in 2010, sounds ominous indeed, but in fact the sheer number shows that the dissent is not organized and has not (yet) coalesced into something that can threaten the state. The Chinese Communist Party would far rather be faced with tens or even hundreds of thousands of separate small-scale incidents than one unified and momentum-gathering insurgency. The greatest fear of the government is not that violent dissent should exist; the fear is that it should coalesce.

The rebellion holds lessons for the West, too. China’s rulers in the 19th century were, as they are today, generally loathed abroad. The Manchus were seen as arrogant and venal despots who obstructed trade and hated foreigners. All romance was on the side of the Taiping rebels, who at the onset were heralded abroad as the liberators of the Chinese people. As one American missionary in Shanghai put it at the time, “Americans are too firmly attached to the principles on which their government was founded and has flourished to refuse sympathy for a heroic people battling against foreign thralldom.”

As Mr. Xi prepares to visit the United States on Tuesday, a similar sympathy shapes our view of China’s current unrest. Just last weekend, Senator John McCain warned China’s vice foreign minister that “the Arab Spring is coming to China.” The dominant tenor of Western press coverage is that the Communist Party is finally receiving its comeuppance — for its corruption, for its misrule in the countryside, for its indifference to human rights and democracy. And below the surface, usually unspoken, lurks a deeply felt sense of schadenfreude — a desire to see the Communist Party toppled from power by its own people.

But we should be careful about what we wish for. For all of the West’s contempt for China’s government in the 19th century, when the Taiping Rebellion actually drove it to the brink of destruction, it was Britain that intervened to keep it in power. Britain’s economy depended so heavily on the China market at the time (especially after the loss of the United States market to the American Civil War in 1861) that it simply could not bear the risk of what might come from a rebel victory. With American encouragement, the British supplied arms, gunships and military officers to the Manchu government and ultimately helped tip the balance of the war in its favor.

We may not be so far removed. Given the precarious state of our economy today, and America’s nearly existential reliance on our trade with China in particular, one wonders: for all of our principled condemnation of China’s government on political and human rights grounds, if it were actually faced with a revolution from within — even one led by a coalition calling for greater democracy — how likely is it that we, too, wouldn’t, in the end, find ourselves hoping for that revolution to fail? "

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-21-12 15:52

The gweilos may have foiled the Hakka Taiping Rebellion against the Manchus by their unwarranted interference in others internal affairs, but the Hakkas succeeded eventually through Sun Yat Sen; and when the usurper Chiang Kai Shek and various warlords, again aided by the gweilos tried to interfere again, the Hakkas again triumphed through the Hakka Long March!

That is why I am so much in awe for my Hakka ancestry; for getting rid of foreigners, be they Manchus or gweilos.

Even if there should be a revolution against the Communists for not maintaining the Three Pillars of Society and thus losing the Mandate from Heaven; gweilos please keep out! Let the Chinese sort out their own internal affairs or civil wars! It is strictly within the family!

cheok hong chuan
22/2/12

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 the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: mr. bean 
Date:   02-21-12 17:08

yes china is about to fall into a rebellion for an even better read just pick up gordon chang "the coming collaspe of china". its the bible of the 'china will fall' genre.

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-21-12 17:12

"getting rid of foreigners...."

You see....you sound exactly like American isolationists. Sorting out own affairs indepedently...yes, I agree.

Fighting an armed civil war within a thermonuclear nation...I'm not so sure there is no place for the UN. Your nation or mine; the rest of us have too much to loose. The entire "family" bull-sh*t argument is far outdated on our small planet.

Chow Lee

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-21-12 17:16

As the article states, few of us Americans want to see an unstable China. Currently most of us are grudging accepting of the status quo. But truth be told, we are smart enough to know there are social and economic challenges that do make China ripe for revolt. Though my yankee economy is challenged when measured against its former self, it remains a far-cry more stable than most other nations. I hope for China's good fortune.

Chow Lee

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 Taishanese Caused The Taiping Rebellion?!?!?!! ;-)
Author: Kobo-Daishi 
Date:   02-21-12 18:24

Dear all,

When I first read this, when it came out last week, I was most struck by this bit:

The uprising was set off by bloody ethnic feuds between Cantonese-speaking Chinese and the minority Hakkas over land rights.

XXXXXX

They still think that the Hakkas are an ethnic minority when they are a part of the majority Han ethnic group.

It really should read:

The uprising was set off by bloody ethnic feuds between Cantonese-speaking Chinese and the minority Hakka-speaking Chinese over land rights.

XXXXX

You know, the "Cantonese-speaking Chinese" were probably Taishanese. ;-0

Yup, Kobo's people. ;-0

We don't speak GOHNG JIU VAH (Guangzhou Hua or Cantonese), but, they always lump us together under "Cantonese".

Our dialects are all under Yue while Hakka is under Hakka. Kejia? ;-0

We'd pronounce it HAHK GAH as well. ;-)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punti-Hakka_Clan_Wars

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punti In the Taishanese I speak it would be BWAHN EIH. ;-0

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakka_people

The coming collaspe (sic) of china.........again?

Hardly. ;-0

Read this bit from the article:

Of course, the current government has little to fear from the example of 1912. The Qing Dynasty, founded in 1644 by Manchu tribesmen who conquered China from the north, was brought down by a highly organized revolutionary movement with overseas arms and financing and a coherent governing ideology based on republican nationalism. The Communist Party today faces nothing like that.

XXXXXX

Maybe if Jesus' little brother were to come again. ;0

But then we're all been waiting for Jesus to come again. ;-0

Perhaps he should try some Viagra. ;-0

And we, Taishanese, might have been the ones who gave the Hakkas their name of "guest families". ;-0

I used to frequent a Taishanese web site and at one time they were selling a book on the history of Taishan.

From when the ancestors of the Taishanese first came down from the north and settled in Taishan to the present.

I didn't buy it because it would have to be shipped from China and I don't even buy stuff shipped from New York let alone overseas.

Now, I kind of regret it. ;-0

Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.

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 Re: Taishanese Caused The Taiping Rebellion?!?!?!! ;-)
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-21-12 18:53

Kobo,

Good to know you are Toishanese. You should feel at home in London or San Francisco Chinatowns.

Hakka is Hakka anywhere in any of the provinces or pecfectures that they have fled to in their migration south.

They were treated as Hakkas [guest people] not just by the Toishanese but by all Punti [local Chinese] people.

The Toishanese themselves are a small minority in Guangdong. How about the Tsiyap and the Samsui and the Szaho and Chungsun and Tsuntak etc.? And we are only talking of the Pearl Delta people!

cheok hong chuan
22/2/12

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-21-12 21:18

Chow Lee,

Let me assure you that when there is a civil war in China, that any foreign involvement will not assist or make things better but rather make things worse. In any case when they press the trigger the missiles are directed at USA not to within China, you moron of a 'banana'!

If there is a civil war in USA, rest assured that nobody will intervene. Why? It will make not make things better either. Too many cooks will spoil the broth!

There is already tribal conflict in Pakistan and religious conflict in India, both nuclear powers. Will foreign intervention or interference assist?

Think before you open your mouth or put your pen to paper. It is not war games but mind games. No Chinese would be so stupid when killing each other to exterminate the entire Chinese race, maybe just kill the 'bananas' like you.

cheok hong chuan
22/2/12

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 Re: Taishanese Caused The Taiping Rebellion?!?!?!! ;-)
Author: Ba Wang Xiao 
Date:   02-21-12 21:20

The CCP is about to install a new leader in Beijing, but wait a minute. isn't this is regime change with Chinese characteristics? Of course it is, but this is the kind of regime change that Uncle Sham does not favor because it hasn't got an American flavor to it a la Libya, Afghanistan , Iraq and soon Syria and Iran, but then again we Chinese don't give a damn what Uncle Sham wants.

Right now there is no popular religious group that can launch a popular revolt in the foreseeable future. There is one though that could threaten the CCP but looks like it has been broken up and its leader is in exile in the US and many of its members languishing in jail. I am referring to the @!#$.

As for the Arab Spring/ Jasmine revolution, just don't forget that the jasmine has been trampled on and stomped so hard into the ground that it has turned into pulp and it won't able to stand up again, not even with viagra.

There is no doubt that the CCP is currently being run by a group of capitalist roaders. Unless it can bring development to the poorer inland regions and narrow the income gulf between the haves of the coastal areas and the have-nots of the poverty stricken inland regions, the poor of the inland provinces could threaten the stability of the country. This may lead to a second communist revolution in China.

Say YES to peac

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-21-12 22:43

Perhaps it is you that should think before penning. You seemed to have difficulty dessecting a very easy to undertand post.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: hohoyan888 
Date:   02-21-12 22:47

Day dreaming

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: FM Liew 
Date:   02-22-12 11:51

I'm a global citizen....I'd love and see the collapse of USA....

And like Gordon Chang who has no responsibity over what he said; I know USA is gonna break-up into 30 states very soon.

I believe I'm part of the majority...

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-22-12 15:06

Chow Lee,

Please learn to respect an old man, if nothing else.

Secondly, please look at yourself in the mirror and in your soul as to whether you are Chinese!

I may be wrong or I may be right, but I write as a loyal and faithful Chinese. And, like any good Buddhist, trained in Zen meditation, I do reflect and contemplate on each thought before I write. Do you? Please do not lie!

And you have a thick skin. A Chinese will know 'shame'. You do not! Despite all these constant tirades against you! I will not put pen to paper if it might bring shame to my parents. A white man knows no shame. You are a gweilo! Do you know what a gweilo means?

A criticism coming from you is worth @!#$! Trust me; a criticism coming from me is an honour, for it puts you on the Way of the Tao!

cheok hong chuan
23/2/12

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-22-12 15:39

To be honest, you seem a bit delusional. the collaspe of either economy would be catastrphic. Get help for whatever is driving your hatred. Please...for the children.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-22-12 15:41

I would expect nothing more than criticism from a man like you. I am an American first. My ethnicity does not define me near as much as my belief system. Skin color is a facade.

Chow Lee

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-22-12 15:50

If you asked me.....Chow-kee....to be honest, I think a complete disintegration of your country won't affect one bit to the rest of the nations on this world of ours.
Well...a initial shock wave.....maybe; but will quickly be swiped aside and a bit of tsk tsk pitying...and that's about all there is.

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-22-12 15:52

That is sort of how much of the planet feels about China, contrary to your denial. So I guess we are both in good company!

Chow Lee

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-22-12 15:58

Wishful thinking isn't healthy at all....a bit like the much touted....American Dream fiasco......it remains wishful.

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-22-12 16:08

One day you speak about how much the world mistreats and demonizes China. The next day you say the opposite? Which way is it? Of course China has allies like iran, North Korea and so on, but those are lapdogs. However, most modern, industrialized nations see China as an unfair business partner and after the recent UN Vote....well, let's just say...Russia, china, Iran, North Korea....birds of a feather, flock together!

Chow Lee

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 russia, iran & north korea are china's friends, so what?
Author: mr. bean 
Date:   02-22-12 18:00

those industrialized nations dont see china as an unfair business partner (when was it fair in the first place?) they cannot accept the fact that china has learned to play their game better than they can.

what is the big deal if russia, iran, north korea are friends of china? they may be your enemies but they arent china's. these nations have done no harm to china and china has zero problems with them so why must china toe the line with the west?

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 Re: russia, iran & north korea are china's friends, so what?
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-22-12 18:25

If that was the case, China would not loose almost every WTO case she gets involved in.

As far as the rest goes...it comes as no surprise that China's yardstick is "who she gets along with" verses what they do. There is little question as China's LARGEST supplier of oil, Iran bought her vote in the UN. China is already being bought and sold by her "friends".

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-22-12 18:40

Chow Lee,

Go gallivanting around in the millions of Yankee web and blog sites then! We do not need you to '@!#$' around a Chinese blog site, if you have an incessant intent for mischief and insult to us Chinese! We do not need you to smell up our 'house'. Go '@!#$' somewhere else. You are American and I am Chinese - that is the end of the story. You have no right to subject me to your constant @!#$! Nee meng pai pu meng pai? Do I blog on a 'banana' or gweilo blog site to give them @!#$? I could not care a '****'. That is called non-intervention!

cheok hong chuan
23/2/12

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 china is just getting warmed up
Author: mr. bean 
Date:   02-22-12 19:04

whether china wins or loses cases in the WTO is not the point. if china does lose a case then they can appeal or accept the verdict. this is the global trading game everyone plays & china plays it well. that is a fact the west has problems dealing with. and btw china has been the recipient of many WTO cases but it can go both ways you can be rest assured china will launch WTO cases against US and western nations in the coming years and trust me the chinese arent the only ones "subsidizing" their industries. the game hasnt even begun yet, the chinese are just getting warmed up.

yes iran is important to china for her supplies of oil to her economy and so what? so the USA the champion of democracy, leader of the free world, defender of human rights shares an important strategic relationship with saudi arabia, kuwait, bahrain, abu dabi and quatar because they all share the values of democracy and religious freedom?

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-23-12 00:49

""No Chinese would be so stupid when killing each other to exterminate the entire Chinese race, maybe just kill the 'bananas' like you.""


Chow Chow who has denounced his ancestry will !!!

关 红 星

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-23-12 01:02

""few of us Americans want to see an unstable China.""

What a hypocritical statement! What is your mission here then?

关 红 星

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-23-12 01:06

""Get help for whatever is driving your hatred.""

How about yours?!

关 红 星

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-23-12 01:13

""That is sort of how much of the planet feels about China""


What a quibbler.

关 红 星

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 Re: russia, iran & north korea are china's friends, so what?
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-23-12 01:22

""China is already being bought and sold by her "friends".""


You should be sniggering then.

关 红 星

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: FM Liew 
Date:   02-23-12 02:01

To be honest, you seem a bit delusional. the collaspe of either economy would be catastrphic. Get help for whatever is driving your hatred. Please...for the children.
=======

I think you are as stupid as before while using Lars as your handle.
Nobody is indispensable, not for a nation, nor an empire.

Empire comes and goes - it's all written in history.

USA will break up into 30 states, and many nations are willing to sponsor the separatism, all in the name of freedom.

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-23-12 09:40

You see anything as insult. By the way, this is an Ohio-based website. Here is a ismple solution...stop reading my posts. Only YOU subject yourself to material you define as offensive.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 11:49

Revolution ? When the government has a 75% vote by its people in stating that they are happy with the status of their government ... unlike the the situation in the US, where the Congress has less than a 15% satisfaction rate , of course, when these @!#$ in Congress and with their @!#$ fed johns in the lobby -- Of course, the Americans are awaken to see and by asking - Why is that every family of 4 Americans are owing more than $500,000? Because the Congress and including the past many presidents have been bribed and persuade by way of money to look the other way - and to have let one non governmental entity named Federal Reserve, printing money at will, to make money for the war industry and to make more the Bank Gangsters rich - and to have over leverage the taxation of the middle class ... Now you tell me, what country is more ready for not revolution, but revolts ? I hope some one will be Hum Gar Shoveling those bankers and make sure they can pay back the debt loads of the innocent Middle Class and tax payers of America ..Do you not think so ?

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 11:50

At the time, the foreigners were raping China daily with a compromising with inept Manchus.

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 11:51

I am all for the Americans to go into isolation - It will make the world much better :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? 99%?...
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:05

Where there is a conflict any where in the world - as in the case of Syria, Iran , Tunisia, Libya , the CIA and Jew money are there -- because these days, abide by the old colonial concept of divide and conquer -- will be paying for tribal divide and sectarian divide and later, they come into for the kill -- but in the case of Iraq, the Russians and the Chinese will get to the oil deal before these western butchers and horses asses .. So, I will have no problem to see the wishes of these bastards and sons of @!#$ @!#$ :) But their games are getting more and more exposed -- Just to see Latin Americans ditching the old Taiwan deals and embracing a progressive and a non intrusive China and their global investment is a joy from the days, where Americans have even overthrowing Guatemala for a few pennies of the labor in Bananas and the country have the same ignorance to have airport named after that pair of American Butchers Dulles - the twin evils who were already on the board of directors of Chiquita Banana -- and thus, bribed Dwight Eisenhower and whatever bimbo at that time, to have Guatemala, the first freely elected president , the first Latin American democracy overthrown --- At that precise time and moment , Che Guevara was in Guatemala City, and he had made vow that this will never happen again in his beloved Latin America --

Che and Fidel had secured the long term safety for Cuba -- and even today, by way of the missiles coming into Cuba to aim at the US --- even the end benefit had given to the Russians, basically, it was merely a counter measure to have the American missiles in Turkey , at that time, aiming toward the Russian removed -- and subsequently, by way of Cuba -- Americans had signed also that they will never be invading Cuba -- in short, Fidel and Che had guaranteed the security of Cuba --

Long live the ideas of the people, be that they are poor or whatsoever -- and the struggle against any phony imperialist and immoral capitalist, phony capitalist because they have taken away , or cheated away the capital of their own citizens -- their middle class with phony printed dollar by way of the Federal Reserve --as the Americans today, per family are now owing more than $500,000 for what ? Who had stolen their money and savings in the bank ? The bank gangsters, and the war morons -- jointly, they have thus far embezzled all the US citizens and these bank gangsters and false war creators -- and the war industry are the real American Madoffs, king of usury and king of Ponzi scheme to all Americans ...

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution..I think so .
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:06

If I were you , as the 1% morons in the US, I will be very worried , extremely worried ..

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US will ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:08

I will be extremely concern over the 99% protesters and the 15% approval rating of the Congressional @!#$ :) If I were Chow Lee :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming morla collaspe of the US
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:10

Gordon's own brain had fallen into his scrotum as of late -- his moral values are all collapsing -- he and Fukiyama , that sayonara Joe will make the best Asian pornographic pair by showing us their mutual sodomy :)

Paul Yih

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 Gordon Chang, that banana turd :)
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:11

Gordon who ? That Banana turd :) lol

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:14

I guess he is into the most altruistic American , so that he and his @!#$ gang banksters can pay off the half million debt load of all Americans -- or each American family -- We will be witnessing that collapse of the American so called Economic system before China's failure :) We do have time to see that all :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of US........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:16

I guess this man will now be assuming all the US debts or maybe Gordon Chang, or maybe Fukiyama -- that banana Sayonara turd:) lol

Paul Yih

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 Re: russia, iran & north korea are china's friends, so what?
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:19

China already has a direct currency swap with Turkey, and China will continue to do direct currency swap with Russia , next Brazil and one by one, China does not have to take on the butt wipe dollar -- That is the best economic war ever .. :) We will have time to see all that development -- and thus far, the US dollar is surviving by the contract that has been written years ago, all Saudi oil are based on dollar -- and let us see how will that go or do in the longer run -- I am all for the gold's return and the gold standard will be one of the determining factor of the future of currency and economics.

Paul Yih

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 Re: china is just getting warmed up
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 12:21

Remember, China's silk road was there over a thousand years ago and longer .. :) we know how to trade, barter trade, trade swap, trade exchange and to by pass all paper currencies :) Then what will the dollar be ?

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-23-12 13:02

Huge revolts are now very common in China. Interesting with a one party system...what other choice do the people really have?

I agree with you on this...the possibility or armed struggle is increasing in the USA.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-23-12 13:03

Chow Lee,

What has the Ohio-based site got to do 'with the price of eggs'?, as my grandmother would put it.

The point is this? Yen hai yen, gwei hai gwei! A Chinese is a Chinese, a foreigner is a foreigner. Ngo hai yen, lei hai Gwei! I am Chinese, you are a foreigner.

You are 'tak yen chang'! You are despised by the Chinese!

cheok hong chuan
24/2/12

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-23-12 14:02

Now you are acting petty and juvenile. Listen to yourself!

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-23-12 14:59

Wrong again Chow Lee! I am a grumpy old man! I grumble when my Western educated children are not frugal and waste money on fancy wines and clothes and cars and not caring about tomorrow or a rainy day and speaking to grandchildren only in English and putting materialism before spiritual practice. My children though adults are the 'juveniles'

Look on the bright side, the broadside I give, I give to my children everyday.

At least they do not answer back! They just keep quiet and realise that they are wrong but simply admit that the temptations of the present, the modern world comes first. For them; they must enjoy life to the full before they die. Their silly idea of - when you die, you are just dead and who cares what comes after! They think my talking to my deceased parents everyday is plain silly! Guess they will never be talking to me when I am dead eh! I can just see them burning all my books on Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism, Hinduism, Islam, Christianity, Greek Philosophy and Shakespeare and Wordsworth and Charles Dicken and Jane Austen etc.

cheok hong chuan
24/2/12

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-23-12 15:08

During the civil war of America, which wasn't that long ago in terms of world history, even brothers from the same womb were shooting against each other.
And, you want to talk about 'huge' revolts in China!

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: CHUNG Yoon Ngan 
Date:   02-23-12 15:56

Dear Hong Chuan,

Before you go leave something behind in the form of books.
I have published five books,
This is my latest book to my siblings and my offspring.
The book is about the history of my family and Malaya from 1858 to 1960.
I spent years on researching about my grand-parents, my father and his siblings and how our my family lived through the two wars - (1) Japanese Occupation of Malaya for 3 years and eight months (2) the Malayan Emergency 1948 to 1960 - a war between the British Colonial Authorities against the Communists who were fighting for the independent of Malaya.
(This book in hard cover is published in New York and the cover was designed by a Japanese)


http://yn.chung.id.au/IMG_0797.JPG

Google will display your good articles to the world to read.
It does not matter if no one in the Forum replies your articles. Sometimes I told the forumites not to reply my articles because it disturbed my writing.

The link to my Hakka book

http://www.poseidonbooks.com/hakkabook.htm

National Library of Australia

http://catalogue.nla.gov.au/Record/1478973

CHUNG Yoon-Ngan
P/s
A Dong Guan Hakka Lao from Pusing

http://yn.chung.id.au/KintaDistrict1942.jpg

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-23-12 16:07

Yes, I do. Likewise i am willing to discuss your perspective on America.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: CHUNG Yoon Ngan 
Date:   02-23-12 16:39

Dear Hong Chuan,

It is wasting time talking to a "Banana Chinese" who was born and
grew up in America. He is every thing American but his look. I am an old
man too and am trying to leave as many of my writing behind as possible.
When you go you cannot take along anything with you. Therefore the best
thing is to leave your thinking behind. Currently I am trying to explain
500 Tang poems in plain Chinese and English. There are many Chinese and
Overseas Chinese who can read the Tang Poems but they don't understand them.
Those poems were written during the period of 618AD to 907AD - 1500 years
ago. So far, I have translated about 300 of them. My target is 500.

I have collected 3.000 Chinese wisdom words of the past.

Please don't waste your pleasure time talking to this 'Banana Chinese"

對牛彈琴 Dui Niu Dan Qin

Good luck

CHUNG Yoon-Ngan

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 16:48

If this one is a banana, he will be the only @!#$ banana in this phorum :) lol

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 16:52

After the Civil War, due to the fact that Lincoln had not accepted the high interest offered by the Rothschild from England -- to the mark of 35% per anum, the Americans in the north have all backed the "green back" of Lincoln -- and thus avoided the high cost of war industry and its blood sucking bankers -- On that note -- I guess that could have been one of the reasons why Lincoln was murdered -- the same obscurity of his murder is almost identical to Kennedy's murder -- Where Kennedy had requested the Federal Reserve to become part of the US treasury .. Go figure . the only other one who had not need the usury banks money was Adolf Hitler.

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-23-12 16:54

Day dreaming and masturbating at the same time, with his father 's picture on the frame :) Call it -- incestuous masturbation ? :) lol or mother , what a pervert -:) lol

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-23-12 17:54

I still must ask myself...how have I ever harmed you or anyone here to deserve such treatment?

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is US ripe for revolution.? I think it is ...
Author: cheok hong chuan 
Date:   02-23-12 20:38

CYN,

You are too kind. I am only semi-retired. Yes, I would love to write a book on The Tao of Filial Piety and Ancestral Reverence, when I retire, and also a commentary on the Vimalakirti Sutra.

But I am only halfway there in my Zen meditation level and practice. When awake, I can keep my mind like an open blank canvas ready to paint or respond on any issue, but I still dream at nights sometimes. If only I can keep an open canvas in my mind so that I do not dream at night but only allow my mind in my sleep to have only the imageries that I determine. I am working on it.

cheok hong chuan
24/2/12

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Zhao Yun 
Date:   02-24-12 03:56

A person may change his name, but the person behind the name(s) never changes! ROFL

The Buddha once said, "What is in a name? A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet. (A lump of sh!t stinks no matter what beautiful name it goes by.)"

Be Happy!

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: CHUNG Yoon Ngan 
Date:   02-24-12 04:12


Confucius said:

君子行不更名,---Jun zi3 xing2 bu4 geng4 ming2,
坐不改姓.----------zuo4 bu4 gai xing4

A gentleman will not alter his name in traveling
and change his surname when settling down.


Posted to asiawind.com
CHUNG Yoon-Ngan

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-24-12 04:46

the contrast is the the XIao REn changing names like changing diapers :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-24-12 04:47

the contrast is the the XIao REn changing names like changing diapers :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-24-12 09:03

Chow-Kee can easily be spelt Cheoi-kee = stink galore !

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-24-12 13:32

We have had this @!#$ stench in here for the longest time :) lol

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-24-12 13:34

Zhao Yun, you meant that certain odor that is very offensive in here :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: charles koon 
Date:   02-25-12 04:52

老趙,

It has been a long time since we had the pleasure of your company. Welcome back!

关 红 星

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-25-12 12:25

I am guessing, by now , after all these time -- 老趙 has two girlfriends, one mistress and maybe three to four babies in mainland :) Haha, just kidding .. :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-25-12 18:22

Like 'em westerners' ways of guesstimating....the 'three or four babies' may, more likely than naught, ......double in number. LOL !
Old Zhoa.....and his sexcapades ......allover the place!

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-26-12 09:14

suen, I am not into "machismo" . it is not so bad to have good "genes" spreading around a bit more :). just think of the reverse, those inbred gene of the Rothchild or that of the Bush family, worse, Condeleeza Rice .....haven forbid...that must come from the poorest of the genes from that 90 year old Sarah....who was given to Abraham. I can see that dog/god ' penile envy....:) Poor Abe....

Paul Yih

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 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: tseman 
Date:   02-26-12 10:52

A rabbi may be, who is teaching some old friends in Shanghai how to acquire State properties with no down payment.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: the coming collaspe of china.........again
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-26-12 11:17

that is why the Opium Holocaust Museum, first online , then the real Museum will tell the word of these bank gangsters and generations of "degenerate" thieves. the future of this museum will be in the Jew center in Shanghai.---Directly on the Bund.

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: observer 
Date:   02-26-12 13:01

Is the US ripe for revolution ? is more appropriate.

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: mr. bean 
Date:   02-26-12 14:16

nope not revolution, the US is ripe for bankruptcy.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-26-12 15:05

the 99% of the protesters will be telling us the truth. not those 1% clowns nor the bank thieves.

Paul Yih

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: tseman 
Date:   02-26-12 16:39

The American dream has turned into a Global Nightmare !!!!!!!!!!!

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-26-12 21:34

the Amercan dream was created by excessive money printing in these past 60 years , it is now an Amercan nightmare in the decades to come, by way of greed and irresponsibity.

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-27-12 15:57

I would disagree. Ameicans can openly dissent. It provides an outlet for emotion, publicly. It is like a volcano that continuesly vents, thus lessoning the possibility of an explosion. The american population is placid other than Politican Science students at the local CC who eventually go on to regular jobs.

Chow Lee

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-28-12 04:03

....."It is like a volcano that continuesly vents, thus lessoning the possibility of an explosion"...

You over-grown hippie.....read some news on USofA .....another kid exploded; killed one and injured many in a Ohio school.

And you like saying things like that to hoodwink yourself!

Incidentally......the Lockerbe air crash has new findings from secret files etc etc. to show that the verdict could had been easily overturned if the facts were to be dragged into the open. Let's see how you ordinary la-la people react to such new findings to have caused old Ghadaphy to have lost his bottom !

i can bet 20 to 1 .....them Templetons will feign as Simpletons and claim they didn't know any better......and that's all to it.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-28-12 04:35

Meantime, I'm gratified that China has changed and taken up a new stance towards world issues to have negated the west to bomb Syria to smithereens and now reacting to this mdm secretary by calling her what she really is .....Super Arrogant.
A correct despcrition, I must say.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution.with now real targets --Bankers ...
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-28-12 09:54

Suen, the future Opium Museum will have to be opening soon and be done far much more online -- and in the collaboration with Wiki Leaks, as you now finding out -- much lies and deception have been planned by both the CIA and others to cover old dirt and to have placed blame onto all others ..

This is merely the tip of the iceberg -- of the lies and games of the war industry and its puppets, their sub-oppressors like the US and UK military and the the rest of EU , or newly joined the West from both the Baltic and the Balkan regions -- they are also have been deceived All have been funded by the agencies and remnants of the Rothschild and their creation of banks and Federal Reserve just so to fuel all wars -- No wonder even Kevin Rudd was one of these agency's sub-oppressors -- All and all, the Anglo American and Australian race have become the mercenaries for the Jewish money empire :)

Paul Yih

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 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Chow Lee 
Date:   02-28-12 12:29

Suen you missed the point completely.

Chow Lee

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: suen.kuen 
Date:   02-28-12 15:21

Forget it...Choel- Kee....TM was a failure in China for you people....now Arab Jasmin Spring is heading no where with fingers all pointing to you guys of the west, the culprits for all the mass killings over there.
Syria will end up the same if China & Russia didn't step up the plate and cast their veto votes.
Looking like this Jasmin thing is back-firing strong onto you western hoodlums.
Its about time.

Reply To This Message
 
 Re: Is China ripe for revolution....
Author: Paul Yih 
Date:   02-28-12 15:24

When one chooses to be influenced by the deceptive dead beats like those @!#$ Loonie Goonies and who reads so called @!#$ , funded by the CIA to discredit China , or any one else -- There is no hope -- :)

Paul Yih

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